Author Topic: Chogyam Trungpa - Ramana Maharshi - J Krishnamurti - Osho  (Read 10745 times)

rideforever

Chogyam Trungpa - Ramana Maharshi - J Krishnamurti - Osho
« on: September 29, 2010, 01:01:09 PM »
Some recommendations for you :

Chogyam Trungpa : Cutting Through Spiritual Materialism
http://www.amazon.com/Cutting-Through-Spiritual-Materialism-Shambhala/dp/1590306392/ref=sr_1_4?s=books&ie=UTF8&qid=1285760982&sr=1-4

-> this book shows how the spiritual path is used as just another materialistic possession by the mind, and shows how to cut through the root of attachments, and also details the functioning of the mind and skandas -> I put this book first because it comes first

----------------------------------------------------------------------
J Krishnamurti : Freedom From the Known
http://www.amazon.com/Freedom-Known-Jiddu-Krishnamurti/dp/0060648082/ref=sr_1_1?s=books&ie=UTF8&qid=1285761012&sr=1-1

-> a book that points you into the unknown in such a powerful way that you could wake from your dream reading it ... each page weighs like a tomb door closing ... the goal is much greater/further than you might realise

----------------------------------------------------------------------
Ramana Maharshi : Be As You Are
http://www.amazon.com/Be-You-Are-Teachings-Maharshi/dp/0140190627/ref=sr_1_2?s=books&ie=UTF8&qid=1285760991&sr=1-2

-> Details the self-enquiry mode of meditation (Who am I ?) ... which is direct.  By focussing on your sense of self you rob the mind of other attachments

----------------------------------------------------------------------
Nisargadatta : I Am That
http://www.amazon.com/Am-That-Talks-Sri-Nisargadatta/dp/0893860220/ref=sr_1_1?s=books&ie=UTF8&qid=1285761002&sr=1-1

-> Speaking from the source

----------------------------------------------------------------------
Osho : Zen Zest Zip Zing !
http://www.osho.be/New-Osho-NL/EnglBooks/Zen%20Zest.htm

-> A great Osho book fun, clear, profound ... exciting you onto the path ... easy to read, compassionate ... serious ... and incredibly funny !!!


Morning Dew

Re: Chogyam Trungpa - Ramana Maharshi - J Krishnamurti - Osho
« Reply #1 on: September 29, 2010, 01:18:25 PM »
J. Krishnamurtis books can be found here as free pdf books;
http://www.messagefrommasters.com/Ebooks/Jiddu-Krishnamurti-Books.htm

But it is enough to read Freedom from the known one time and the rest are talking about the same. I am sure osho and the rest are the same.
Read one book, get the message and keep on observing ur self on ur own. Throw the book away.
None of them can awake you but only shock you the ego you. It is still the ego you which got this new Krishnamurti idea :)

If you are in need for these kind of books every now and then there is something wrong with ur practice. See what this is and observe it until its corrected.

If ur practice is right there will be no need for Very encouraging Krishnamurti or Osho or whoever words :)
Be your own Krishnamurti or Osho or Super Meditator :) and observe your self being your own Krishnamurti or Osho or Super Meditator till that self dies ;)

Thanks for the links but that time i rather put into excercising, dog walking, dishwashing, farting and meditating :)

Remain relaxed or dont

kidnovice

  • Member
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Re: Chogyam Trungpa - Ramana Maharshi - J Krishnamurti - Osho
« Reply #2 on: September 29, 2010, 10:11:32 PM »
J. Krishnamurtis books can be found here as free pdf books;
http://www.messagefrommasters.com/Ebooks/Jiddu-Krishnamurti-Books.htm

Thanks for the awesome resource, MD. I've been meaning to read JK for a while. After I bookmarked the page, I began reading about his life (which is pretty amazing!), and here's something interesting that I noticed. His teachings totally reflect the process by which his awakening occurred. And its same with the Buddha.

Here's the most authoritative and absolutely trustworthy description of JK's awakening (from Wikipedia :)):

Quote
According to witnesses, it all started on 17 August 1922, with Krishnamurti complaining of extraordinary pain at the nape of his neck, and a hard, ball-like swelling. Over the next couple of days, the symptoms worsened, with increasing pain, extreme physical discomfort and sensitivity, total loss of appetite and occasional delirious ramblings. Then, he seemed to lapse into unconsciousness; instead he recounted that he was very much aware of his surroundings, and that while in that state he had an experience of mystical union.[59] The following day the symptoms and the experience intensified, climaxing with a sense of "immense peace".[60]

    I was supremely happy, for I had seen. Nothing could ever be the same. I have drunk at the clear and pure waters and my thirst
    was appeased... I have seen the Light. I have touched compassion which heals all sorrow and suffering; it is not for myself, but for
    the world... Love in all its glory has intoxicated my heart; my heart can never be closed. I have drunk at the fountain of Joy and
     eternal Beauty. I am God-intoxicated.[61]

Following - and apparently related to - these events,[62] in early September a strange condition, which came to be known as the process, started as an almost nightly, regular, occurrence. These new incidents continued with short intermissions until October; later, the process would resume intermittently. As in the separate three-day experience of August, the process involved varying degrees of pain, physical discomfort and sensitivity, occasionally a lapse into a "childlike" state, and sometimes an apparent fading out of consciousness explained - by Krishnamurti or those attending him - as either his body giving in to pain, or as him "going off".[63]

Basically, JK's awakening(s) happened TO him, without a teacher, almost like an accident--in a moment(s) of grace. From the small bits I have read, it seems like his teaching naturally reflected this. He was against having a teacher, and was always pointing toward each person having a spontaneous awakening.

The Buddha's awakening process was quite different. He did have a spontaneous experience of joyful absorption as a child, but that wasn't exactly his awakening. Really his awakening process began with a powerful desire to find freedom from suffering. His process from that point onwards was extremely intentional (visiting different teachers, each of whom he ultimately decided was insuffucient) and involved alot of training his mind to reach the point where there was ultimate freedom from suffering. Basically, he worked his ass off (pun intended), and once he had attained the freedom he sought (his awakening), his teachings reflected that process.

I thought that was cool to think about. Different processes, different teachings.  :)
« Last Edit: September 29, 2010, 10:40:04 PM by kidnovice »
May we cultivate the serenity to accept the things we cannot change; the compassion to change the things we can; and the wisdom to know the difference.

Lokuttara

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Re: Chogyam Trungpa - Ramana Maharshi - J Krishnamurti - Osho
« Reply #3 on: October 01, 2010, 03:28:36 PM »
Here is a very detailed description of his awakening, including some referenced to the Buddhic plane:
http://www.bodysoulandspirit.net/mystical_experiences/read/notables/krishnamurti.shtml


This piece is interesting:
Quote
There I sat crosslegged in the meditation posture. When I had sat thus for some time, I felt myself going out of my body, I saw myself sitting down with the delicate tender leaves of the tree over me. I was facing the east. In front of me was my body and over my head I saw the Star, bright and clear. Then I could feel the vibrations of the Lord Buddha; I beheld Lord Maitreya and Master K.H. I was so happy, calm and at peace. I could still see my body and I was hovering near it. There was such profound calmness both in the air and within myself, the calmness of the bottom of a deep unfathomable lake. Like the lake, I felt my physical body, with its mind and emotions, could be ruffled on the surface but nothing, nay nothing, could disturb the calmness of my soul. The Presence of the mighty Beings was with me for some time and then They were gone. I was supremely happy, for I had seen. Nothing could ever be the same. I have drunk at the clear and pure waters at the source of the fountain of life and my thirst was appeased. Never more could I be thirsty, never more could I be in utter darkness. I have seen the Light. I have touched compassion which heals all sorrow and suffering; it is not for myself, but for the world. I have stood on the mountain top and gazed at the mighty Beings. Never can I be in utter darkness; I have seen the glorious and healing Light. The fountain of Truth has been revealed to me and the darkness has been dispersed. Love in all its glory has intoxicated my heart; my heart can never be closed. I have drunk at the fountain of Joy and eternal Beauty. I am God-intoxicated."

"One may be surrounded by great beauty, by mountains and fields and rivers, but unless one is alive to it all one might just as well be dead." Krishnamurti

Matthew

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Re: Chogyam Trungpa - Ramana Maharshi - J Krishnamurti - Osho
« Reply #4 on: October 01, 2010, 04:31:56 PM »
"I am God-intoxicated."

Couple of problems with that bit. God is a man made construct, an intellectual idea. He was clearly labelling experience based on his conditioning. Yes he wrote some very lucid works however the level of attainment he achieved is something I would question.
~oOo~     Tat Tvam Asi     ~oOo~    How will you make the world a better place today?     ~oOo~    Fabricate Nothing     ~oOo~

Lokuttara

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Re: Chogyam Trungpa - Ramana Maharshi - J Krishnamurti - Osho
« Reply #5 on: October 01, 2010, 04:53:43 PM »
But remember, this is stuff he himself would have denounced in later years - the labels I mean, not the experience. He was quite young when all this happened, wasn't he?
"One may be surrounded by great beauty, by mountains and fields and rivers, but unless one is alive to it all one might just as well be dead." Krishnamurti

joy

  • Member
Re: Chogyam Trungpa - Ramana Maharshi - J Krishnamurti - Osho
« Reply #6 on: October 02, 2010, 07:54:24 AM »
Question ends when there is no more conditioning.

It is not wise to pick one small sentence out of whole and interpret it according to our own conditioned mind! 

Let's hear what Osho said about God/Bhagwan:

"Our meaning of Bhagwan is totally different. We call him Buddha, Bhagwan, because he has now no more desires. He is contented. He is happy and at home. He has come home—that is his blessedness. Now there is no conflict between him and existence. He has fallen in accord, in harmonia. Now he and the whole are not two separate things. They vibrate in the same way. He has become part of the orchestra of the whole. And by becoming a part of this great orchestra of stars and trees and flowers and winds and clouds and seas and sands, he has become blessed—we call him Bhagwan….

I have never called myself godman. Yes, the people who love me have called me Bhagwan, but Bhagwan does not mean God. We have called Gautam Buddha 'Bhagwan'—and he does not believe in any god. We have called Mahavira 'Bhagwan'—and he does not believe in any God.
So 'Bhagwan' cannot be synonymous with God. 'Bhagwan' simply means the blessed one,—one who has attained the ultimate bliss, the peace, the joy of his own being. And I say unto you that I am the blessed one, but I am not the godman. I am simply a man fulfilled.........."
Joy

rideforever

Re: Chogyam Trungpa - Ramana Maharshi - J Krishnamurti - Osho
« Reply #7 on: October 03, 2010, 04:24:55 PM »
Quote
There I sat crosslegged in the meditation posture. When I had sat thus for some time, I felt myself going out of my body, I saw myself sitting down with the delicate tender leaves of the tree over me. I was facing the east. In front of me was my body and over my head I saw the Star, bright and clear. Then I could feel the vibrations of the Lord Buddha; I beheld Lord Maitreya and Master K.H. I was so happy, calm and at peace. I could still see my body and I was hovering near it. There was such profound calmness both in the air and within myself, the calmness of the bottom of a deep unfathomable lake. Like the lake, I felt my physical body, with its mind and emotions, could be ruffled on the surface but nothing, nay nothing, could disturb the calmness of my soul. The Presence of the mighty Beings was with me for some time and then They were gone. I was supremely happy, for I had seen. Nothing could ever be the same. I have drunk at the clear and pure waters at the source of the fountain of life and my thirst was appeased. Never more could I be thirsty, never more could I be in utter darkness. I have seen the Light. I have touched compassion which heals all sorrow and suffering; it is not for myself, but for the world. I have stood on the mountain top and gazed at the mighty Beings. Never can I be in utter darkness; I have seen the glorious and healing Light. The fountain of Truth has been revealed to me and the darkness has been dispersed. Love in all its glory has intoxicated my heart; my heart can never be closed. I have drunk at the fountain of Joy and eternal Beauty. I am God-intoxicated."


 Holy sh*t

Morning Dew

Re: Chogyam Trungpa - Ramana Maharshi - J Krishnamurti - Osho
« Reply #8 on: October 03, 2010, 04:29:25 PM »
What a trip ay ay ayyyy ;)
I think he was on drugs
Breath JK breath! Thats what happens when you breath shallow in meditation. Halucinations ;)
Say no more!
« Last Edit: October 03, 2010, 04:32:20 PM by Morning Dew »

Lokuttara

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Re: Chogyam Trungpa - Ramana Maharshi - J Krishnamurti - Osho
« Reply #9 on: October 03, 2010, 05:21:40 PM »
Breath JK breath! Thats what happens when you breath shallow in meditation. Halucinations ;)
Say no more!

Is it? I have also experienced some very shallow breathing in meditation, when the breath almost seems to stop...naturally. Happens in most of my sittings when the mind is quiet. You say it is important to try and change this?

As for the whole God argument - it's all labels, words, etc. It's not good or bad, because the word is not the thing. But I think we can understand what is being "pointed to" to by the words, if we are following it... and look beyond our conditioning around certain words. I sometimes say I feel at one with God, but a Christian or anti-christian person would have a lot of baggage around that word and would interpret it in their own way. A person who meditates may just say "yes, wonderful", because they would understand what the words point to, instead of reacting to the images conjured up by those words... instead of getting bogged down in the associations of thise words. Words are not important imo, but let us look beyond them into the infinite.

The word is not the thing.
"One may be surrounded by great beauty, by mountains and fields and rivers, but unless one is alive to it all one might just as well be dead." Krishnamurti

joy

  • Member
Re: Chogyam Trungpa - Ramana Maharshi - J Krishnamurti - Osho
« Reply #10 on: October 04, 2010, 06:03:18 AM »


As for the whole God argument - it's all labels, words, etc. It's not good or bad, because the word is not the thing. But I think we can understand what is being "pointed to" to by the words, if we are following it... and look beyond our conditioning around certain words. I sometimes say I feel at one with God, but a Christian or anti-christian person would have a lot of baggage around that word and would interpret it in their own way. A person who meditates may just say "yes, wonderful", because they would understand what the words point to, instead of reacting to the images conjured up by those words... instead of getting bogged down in the associations of thise words. Words are not important imo, but let us look beyond them into the infinite.

The word is not the thing.

And unfortunately word is only available medium to express the Inexpressible
« Last Edit: October 04, 2010, 06:37:03 AM by joydip_ppl »
Joy

Matthew

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    • If you cling to view, you must know this limits your potential.
Re: Chogyam Trungpa - Ramana Maharshi - J Krishnamurti - Osho
« Reply #11 on: October 12, 2010, 08:13:31 AM »
As for the whole God argument - it's all labels, words, etc.

...

I sometimes say I feel at one with God

...

The word is not the thing.

So what do you mean by this word "God" as you use it - the thing you "feel at one with" sometimes? Please clarify.
~oOo~     Tat Tvam Asi     ~oOo~    How will you make the world a better place today?     ~oOo~    Fabricate Nothing     ~oOo~

Lokuttara

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Re: Chogyam Trungpa - Ramana Maharshi - J Krishnamurti - Osho
« Reply #12 on: October 14, 2010, 02:57:52 AM »
Presence, awareness, and experiencing something that is beyond the field of the known. Feels like a limitless energy, or vibration. Like going into the infinite unmanifested, non-self, non-ego... there are so many words to describe the "God" :)
"One may be surrounded by great beauty, by mountains and fields and rivers, but unless one is alive to it all one might just as well be dead." Krishnamurti

 

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