Meditation Vipassana and visualisation about being wealthy and healthy

[Chaska]

Dear Dhamma community
And thanks again to Matthew that run this forum for a long time.
I found so many good insight everytime here.

I stopped meditating (vipassana 1H at least a day, 8 months ago when my grand father past away, I run out of the pain by working a lot, my business became very profitable).

Now I am at a stage where I am lost.
I want to be back to Vipassana as I see myself being less and less compassionate, patient etc.. and in the same time I don’t want to loose that momentum in my business. (I do visualisations everyday, and I use the law of attraction which works very well).

Could this go together? I mean getting back on track on my daily sitting and keep on practicing the low of attraction? This sounds wrong to me..
I am a bit lost..

Thanks a lot for any insight !

Marine

[Matthew]

Hello Marine,

Sorry to hear you lost your grandfather - these relationships can be very foundational to how we perceive and live in this world.

The law of attraction might not work well with meditation as it's a form of fabrication. That's not to say there isn't a way forward, I think there is. Meditation can help you centre yourself, see things clearly, and as you recognise, be compassionate. These qualities can be applied to your business as they can to any aspect of life.

A calm, centred, clear seeing business person is more likely to be happy in their life, and successful in business, than an angry, half-blind, uncaring business person.

Maybe this way you can bring these goals together to work for you in all aspects of your life?

Perhaps the best thing is just to start sitting again? - I'm pretty sure you will find the right balance for yourself by 'getting back on the horse'.

Warm regards,

Matthew

[raushan]

(I do visualisations everyday, and I use the law of attraction which works very well).

Could this go together? I mean getting back on track on my daily sitting and keep on practicing the low of attraction? This sounds wrong to me..
I am a bit lost..

Thanks a lot for any insight !

Marine

This has confused me for many years. Still confuses me. Because some realized people say as you become more Buddha like you can achieve anythng in the world. But at the same time people who meditate have lesser desire and hence I would say they will have lesser drive to succeed in the world. To me also both seems opposite. I can't give any definite answer. But at the same time being in a present moment, being free of anxiety or fearr should makes someone most productive.

[Guillaume]

Could this go together? I mean getting back on track on my daily sitting and keep on practicing the low of attraction? This sounds wrong to me..

Hi Marine,

Sorry for your loss, there are always bad times we need to go through unfortunately.

For the law of attraction and meditation, I've been thinking a lot about that recently.
For most people, we have what we imagined and planned for our life. If you consciously and positively walk towards any realistic goal that doesn't harm anyone / anything, there is no reason for it not to happen.
But meditation and spiritual practices encourage more to raise our consciousness to let go of our fears and desires.
If you can reach transcendental states, all possessions, money, comfort, social status etc will progressively become useless.

People often present the law of attraction as a magical thing that can bring you anything you desire, and that will fulfill anything in yourself.
Although it works surprisingly well (I have tested as well), the way it is presented is usually a completely wrong picture of what life is about, usually like marketing tricks, like all the ads we get all the time that depict an 'ideal life'.

If you become a millionaire, will you speak to thousands of people at the same time? Will you eat 100 times more? No! Rich or poor, we stay the same, we have to sleep the same amount of time, we shouldn't eat more (or we'll get sick), eating meat makes us sick, traveling all the time even in the best paradise islands is exhausting, and drinking crazy amount of alcohol or taking crazy amount of drugs will just make anyone miserable!

Health is not abundance also, it's probably the opposite, in the world we live, we suffer more from our excesses than anything else. And if we listen to our body, it will tell us what we do wrong if anything.

But, there is a 'but' ... Is living in the mountains realistic? If we live in cities, how much money is necessary to live in a decent flat?
All these practices were created at a time when there was more wildlife and when cities were not that big. With 7 billion humans, it's harder to adapt, although many could argue that there's still a lot of room in the Himalayas!
But realistically, I think using the law of attraction to get the necessary money to live in our society is not a problem, if we work for this system without wanting to steal or take advantage of it, it's all about the intention. Using it to get expensive cars that will make others jealous or flying around the world to visit hotels ... I don't think it's the right way to go.
I think finding the right path and the right way of doing in our present time is just about following our heart. Listening to our body, to our little voice within us. The universe / nature / anything living will give you answers if you listen to it anyways. Don't hesitate to question the universe, ask for signs or answers, you'll get them (very fast!). And meditation is the best to raise your consciousness about it.

Hoping I could bring a bit of light

[Matthew]

This has confused me for many years. Still confuses me. Because some realized people say as you become more Buddha like you can achieve anythng in the world. But at the same time people who meditate have lesser desire and hence I would say they will have lesser drive to succeed in the world.
...

For me the very definition of "success in the world" has been changed by practice and following the Dhamma. It no longer hinges upon material success and the like, more upon the quality of present moment life, and what I can do right now to make a difference in the world.

[dharma bum]

Because some realized people say as you become more Buddha like you can achieve anythng in the world.

Who are some examples of people like that? If you say Steve Jobs or Elon Musk, then I should point out that they are nothing like the Buddha.

[raushan]

Because some realized people say as you become more Buddha like you can achieve anythng in the world.

Who are some examples of people like that? If you say Steve Jobs or Elon Musk, then I should point out that they are nothing like the Buddha.

To achieve anything worthwhile in life one has to give extreme level of sacrifice which normal people don't do. It's a fact. Either it can be in scientific world or Business or spiritual. I have seen it experienced it. I don't need anyone confirmation to know that.

[dharma bum]

To achieve anything worthwhile in life one has to give extreme level of sacrifice which normal people don't do. It's a fact. Either it can be in scientific world or Business or spiritual. I have seen it experienced it. I don't need anyone confirmation to know that.

I think it helps to be more specific.

To achieve great success like Steve Jobs, you have to sacrifice peace of mind.
To achieve peace of mind, you have to sacrifice success of the sort Steve Jobs got.

These are not equivalent statements. To achieve great peace of mind is not identical to achiving great wealth. Maybe it needs some personality traits that are common - such as perseverance but they are not the same. A corrupt, crooked person can also be a very persevering person.

So a great achiever in entreprenuership is not the same as a Buddha.

[dharma bum]

As Matthew points out, the definition of success is very subjective. To many people Steve Jobs is very successful, but if it comes at a cost of being obnoxious to everybody around, then I ask if he is truly successful. It's the same with Elon Musk. Elon Musk picks fights with somebody who is trying to rescue some kids in Thailand. And then keeps insulting the guy. This is a guy who can launch rockets to Mars, but has no self-control.

We often get influenced by praise and criticism, which are really the same thing. Because people praise people with great wealth and power, we regard them as high status. But wealth, power and fame are traps. People spend a lot of time and energy maintaining their wealth and power and fame. This is the Buddhist position.

Some gurus claim you can 'achieve anything you want' if you do their meditation. Such gurus should be avoided IMO.

Many years ago, I attended a meditation session and at the end the teacher said, "Make a wish with all your heart and it will come true". This is all nonsense. Meditation doesn't make you special.

[raushan]

Some personal issues going on with me currently. I won't be able to participate in the discussion. Sorry. But I agree we shouldn't idolize just one person. Everyone has good and bad.

[dharma bum]

Some personal issues going on with me currently. I won't be able to participate in the discussion. Sorry. But I agree we shouldn't idolize just one person. Everyone has good and bad.

That's fine. No pressure from me.

I personally find it hard to judge, say, someone like Bill Gates. By many accounts not a pleasant person to work with. He made a lot of money, some by squashing competition, but he also engages in a lot of philanthropic work.

The obvious question is - why do I need to judge Bill Gates and what does it accomplish. Also good questions are - how much money does a person need? And what is the purpose of money?

A lot of questions that may be answered. Or not (who cares! )

[Chaska]

Thanks Matthew Guillaume Razan, Dhamma bun and everyone who take the time to share their thoughts on my topic 🙏🏼

I will let you know how it goes. I apply for a 20 days service in September and in the same time I launch a new business. So will see how that goes. Méditation / attraction laws..

I do agree with the point that says, success come with the energy you put into something. If it is money and business it’s not the same as if it is spiritual. The results would be different. It feels right.
I shows me that I am attached to that external world and as I meditate less and less recently I grew satisfaction from that growth.
I still don’t know where is the limit and how to manage both in my life.

I feel like having enough is great but in the same time I feel like the purpose of life is to get better.

Let’s say if I can grow my business and help more people (thanks to my business) and earn more money. It seems exciting to go forward and to call for the law of attraction.
The question is, am I willing to use the law for myself or for helping others. And the truth is that is all ego centered.

So it’s difficult to dissolve the ego and then make it stronger through that kind of practice.

I am not ready to let go that part at the moment.
I will keep you updated !!

Metta
And thanks again 

[Guillaume]

I feel like having enough is great but in the same time I feel like the purpose of life is to get better.

If you're not feeling well, of course. And there are 2 main options, not contradictory: you can work on growing your comfort, and reducing your needs at the same time. It's just that in some areas we may need more (space, quietness, ...) and others we may need less (food, pleasures, ... ).

Let’s say if I can grow my business and help more people (thanks to my business) and earn more money. It seems exciting to go forward and to call for the law of attraction.

Then let it be done. It works best when you visualize clearly your objective, then all the steps needed to achieve it. Don't hesitate to visualize each and every step in all its details. Then you work on them by order of priority. Give your best at every moment, "mets du coeur à l'ouvrage", don't hesitate to give yourself over to it, the universe loves it! 

Then if you don't know what to do with all that money, just reach out to me