Author Topic: Any tips for doing less Im trying for nothing but im not fully nothing  (Read 297 times)

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 any tips for doing less Im trying for nothing but im not fully doing nothing im doing a little something

(sorry changed the question from original which was about being blissful)
« Last Edit: February 06, 2021, 12:36:00 PM by Username »

stillpointdancer

  • stillpointdancer
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  • Retired teacher, deepening understanding of Dharma
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    • Exploring the results of 30 years of meditating
Re: Any tips for getting to higher more ecstatic states?
« Reply #1 on: February 06, 2021, 11:51:51 AM »
The good news is that meditation can be blissful and is certainly 'better' than alcohol or drugs. The bad news is that it isn't the purpose of meditation, just a side effect which may turn up after twenty years of meditating, to be ignored because by that time you know that is not the reason you meditate. My advice would be to try some nice relaxing meditation-style exercises for a while and see if they do anything for you.
“You do not need to leave your room. Remain sitting at your table and listen. Do not even listen, simply wait, be quiet, still and solitary. The world will freely offer itself to you to be unmasked, it has no choice, it will roll in ecstasy at your feet.” Franz Kafka

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Re: Any tips for getting to higher more ecstatic states?
« Reply #2 on: February 06, 2021, 12:05:08 PM »
The good news is that meditation can be blissful and is certainly 'better' than alcohol or drugs. The bad news is that it isn't the purpose of meditation, just a side effect which may turn up after twenty years of meditating, to be ignored because by that time you know that is not the reason you meditate. My advice would be to try some nice relaxing meditation-style exercises for a while and see if they do anything for you.

thanks brother hehehe :))) Thats great advice, give up for 20 years xDDDDDDDDD Very good teaching :)))

What about turning the last bit of resistance off? I hate that im almost there some remaining bit still is there

Alex

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Re: Any tips for doing less Im trying for nothing but im not fully nothing
« Reply #3 on: February 06, 2021, 12:49:59 PM »
The good news is that meditation can be blissful and is certainly 'better' than alcohol or drugs. The bad news is that it isn't the purpose of meditation, just a side effect which may turn up after twenty years of meditating, to be ignored because by that time you know that is not the reason you meditate. My advice would be to try some nice relaxing meditation-style exercises for a while and see if they do anything for you.

We know where we both stand on this, stillpointdancer ;) but I feel the need to balance the views presented here…
There is no harm in cultivating (not chasing) deep states of calm/concentration/bliss. Imho bliss is not merely a side effect of letting go and concentration, it is intrinsically linked with it and nurtures or nourishes its deepening.

im doing a little something

The letting go of that little something will come from awareness of what you are doing rather then trying to do something else to change or improve your meditation.
Just be mindful of what you’re doing, follow it moment to moment…

I hate that im almost there some remaining bit still is there

This seems to give you some indication of what you are ‘doing’.
There seems to be a desire for/attachement to a certain result. This agitation can be strong or subtle, but will hinder the deepening of your meditation.
Maybe also ask yourself what your intention is, the degree to which the ego is involved... above all, cultivate concentration/bliss for its wholesome qualities...
In addition, you might consider your lifestile or life circumstances and the degree to which they support letting go. There are other threads regarding tips for deepening concentration / letting go...

Kindly
Alex

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Re: Any tips for doing less Im trying for nothing but im not fully nothing
« Reply #4 on: February 06, 2021, 01:46:59 PM »
The good news is that meditation can be blissful and is certainly 'better' than alcohol or drugs. The bad news is that it isn't the purpose of meditation, just a side effect which may turn up after twenty years of meditating, to be ignored because by that time you know that is not the reason you meditate. My advice would be to try some nice relaxing meditation-style exercises for a while and see if they do anything for you.

We know where we both stand on this, stillpointdancer ;) but I feel the need to balance the views presented here…
There is no harm in cultivating (not chasing) deep states of calm/concentration/bliss. Imho bliss is not merely a side effect of letting go and concentration, it is intrinsically linked with it and nurtures or nourishes its deepening.

im doing a little something

The letting go of that little something will come from awareness of what you are doing rather then trying to do something else to change or improve your meditation.
Just be mindful of what you’re doing, follow it moment to moment…

I hate that im almost there some remaining bit still is there

This seems to give you some indication of what you are ‘doing’.
There seems to be a desire for/attachement to a certain result. This agitation can be strong or subtle, but will hinder the deepening of your meditation.
Maybe also ask yourself what your intention is, the degree to which the ego is involved... above all, cultivate concentration/bliss for its wholesome qualities...
In addition, you might consider your lifestile or life circumstances and the degree to which they support letting go. There are other threads regarding tips for deepening concentration / letting go...

Kindly
Alex



Thanks Alex bro, your meditation skill is very impressive,  you know exactly the details and more, I really appreciate it sir! Big up your self, tough guy !
« Last Edit: February 06, 2021, 01:50:55 PM by Username »

Username

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Re: Any tips for doing less Im trying for nothing but im not fully nothing
« Reply #5 on: February 06, 2021, 06:24:24 PM »
The good news is that meditation can be blissful and is certainly 'better' than alcohol or drugs. The bad news is that it isn't the purpose of meditation, just a side effect which may turn up after twenty years of meditating, to be ignored because by that time you know that is not the reason you meditate. My advice would be to try some nice relaxing meditation-style exercises for a while and see if they do anything for you.

We know where we both stand on this, stillpointdancer ;) but I feel the need to balance the views presented here…
There is no harm in cultivating (not chasing) deep states of calm/concentration/bliss. Imho bliss is not merely a side effect of letting go and concentration, it is intrinsically linked with it and nurtures or nourishes its deepening.

im doing a little something

The letting go of that little something will come from awareness of what you are doing rather then trying to do something else to change or improve your meditation.
Just be mindful of what you’re doing, follow it moment to moment…

I hate that im almost there some remaining bit still is there

This seems to give you some indication of what you are ‘doing’.
There seems to be a desire for/attachement to a certain result. This agitation can be strong or subtle, but will hinder the deepening of your meditation.
Maybe also ask yourself what your intention is, the degree to which the ego is involved... above all, cultivate concentration/bliss for its wholesome qualities...
In addition, you might consider your lifestile or life circumstances and the degree to which they support letting go. There are other threads regarding tips for deepening concentration / letting go...

Kindly
Alex

There is some desire intention or just sheer tensing , Im aware of it, why on earth does it stay if im aware of it. Im not doing anything unconciously and yet it still remains (the tensing intention desire etc)

I see my self my ego myself talk to teh point where it all vanishes and im completely empty bar this tensing or this intention and I even see that/those 2 and they still remain.

WHY?


Also am I under a false idea that awareness alone is enough? Does it need to be awareness AND something else together (like loving kindness and many other options along side the awareness) and awareness alone is never enough?

« Last Edit: February 06, 2021, 06:27:33 PM by Username »

Alex

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Re: Any tips for doing less Im trying for nothing but im not fully nothing
« Reply #6 on: February 07, 2021, 02:24:40 PM »
Thanks Alex bro, your meditation skill is very impressive,  you know exactly the details and more, I really appreciate it sir! Big up your self, tough guy !

:D :D :D

There is some desire intention or just sheer tensing , Im aware of it, why on earth does it stay if im aware of it. Im not doing anything unconciously and yet it still remains (the tensing intention desire etc)

I see my self my ego myself talk to teh point where it all vanishes and im completely empty bar this tensing or this intention and I even see that/those 2 and they still remain.

WHY?


Also am I under a false idea that awareness alone is enough? Does it need to be awareness AND something else together (like loving kindness and many other options along side the awareness) and awareness alone is never enough?


Good questions!
You are on the right track questioning the quality of awareness.
Is there such a thing as bare attention? How does understanding/wisdom influence awareness? And what do openness or metta bring to the meditation? What about your intentions?

Ask yourself, moment to moment, "How am I relating to what I experience my meditation?", "How am I meeting the tension?", "How am I meeting the desire?". Keep monitoring that. And if you notice something, don’t try to correct. Investigate a little. If you notice part of you wanting to correct, investigate that. ;)

The tensions will dissolve, but also practice patience. Even when practiced well, it takes time for the fruits of meditation to develop.

Username

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Re: Any tips for doing less Im trying for nothing but im not fully nothing
« Reply #7 on: February 07, 2021, 08:26:34 PM »
Thanks Alex bro, your meditation skill is very impressive,  you know exactly the details and more, I really appreciate it sir! Big up your self, tough guy !

:D :D :D

There is some desire intention or just sheer tensing , Im aware of it, why on earth does it stay if im aware of it. Im not doing anything unconciously and yet it still remains (the tensing intention desire etc)

I see my self my ego myself talk to teh point where it all vanishes and im completely empty bar this tensing or this intention and I even see that/those 2 and they still remain.

WHY?


Also am I under a false idea that awareness alone is enough? Does it need to be awareness AND something else together (like loving kindness and many other options along side the awareness) and awareness alone is never enough?


Good questions!
You are on the right track questioning the quality of awareness.
Is there such a thing as bare attention? How does understanding/wisdom influence awareness? And what do openness or metta bring to the meditation? What about your intentions?

Ask yourself, moment to moment, "How am I relating to what I experience my meditation?", "How am I meeting the tension?", "How am I meeting the desire?". Keep monitoring that. And if you notice something, don’t try to correct. Investigate a little. If you notice part of you wanting to correct, investigate that. ;)

The tensions will dissolve, but also practice patience. Even when practiced well, it takes time for the fruits of meditation to develop.

Wow you are masterful,  I was serene, and seemingly totally empty but I wasnt, a new thought had "just come in " which I didnt notice and it was very subtle because it was my vague reaction to it not going well as I wanted it to. Not a clear thought like self talk normally is, more a mere reaction type thought which I didn't know existed as a type of thought.

So basically awareness alone is enough, and if its not going right you are doing something you cant see end of story.

Thanks so much Alex my friend, you are stunningly masterful!! I really appreciate you!! :))))

« Last Edit: February 07, 2021, 08:29:12 PM by Username »

Username

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Re: Any tips for doing less Im trying for nothing but im not fully nothing
« Reply #8 on: February 08, 2021, 01:43:29 AM »
I think that reactionary thought that came "back in" was my self my ego that had gone but had come back in again (into unconsciousness)

 

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