Author Topic: Questions about vipassana  (Read 3493 times)

sophia

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Questions about vipassana
« on: January 27, 2016, 01:31:56 PM »
Hi there. I started reading a book: Sayadaw U Pandita - In this very life. In his book vipassana lead to vipassana jhanas. One of my friend doesn't really believe in vipassana jhanas and he thinks Sayadaw U Pandita and teachers who teach the vipassana tradition those are misguided. He doesn't believe in teachings of vipassana teachers he doesn't believes that vipassana leads to nibbana without attain samatha jhanas. I think he is not true. I believe in vipassana jhanas and i believe vipassana lead to nibbana. Are there anyone who experienced a vipassana jhana or a very deep state of concentration in vipassana meditation?  Or are there anyone who attained stream entry without samatha jhana attainment?

purity

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Re: Questions about vipassana
« Reply #1 on: January 28, 2016, 09:44:09 AM »
Hullo,   I achieved some extremely deep Jhana states when on retreat.  Was the most amazing thing that has ever happened to me. One particular experience I had it was like I was floating up and very intense waves of tingling swept over my entire body. Every cell in my body was vibrating and I heard what seemed to be some kind of shamanic chanting.   It was like sex and drugs times a thousand.  I never believed this sort of thing, I am a skeptical type and so I had no idea it could happen until it happened to me.  I was high for days after. I had to let the experience go after that because I could see that it could become a hindrance if I continued to crave for more.  I actually became a bit depressed for a short while because I wanted to feel like that all the time.
« Last Edit: January 28, 2016, 09:46:43 AM by purity »

sophia

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Re: Questions about vipassana
« Reply #2 on: January 28, 2016, 10:05:20 AM »
Hullo,   I achieved some extremely deep Jhana states when on retreat.  Was the most amazing thing that has ever happened to me. One particular experience I had it was like I was floating up and very intense waves of tingling swept over my entire body. Every cell in my body was vibrating and I heard what seemed to be some kind of shamanic chanting.   It was like sex and drugs times a thousand.  I never believed this sort of thing, I am a skeptical type and so I had no idea it could happen until it happened to me.  I was high for days after. I had to let the experience go after that because I could see that it could become a hindrance if I continued to crave for more.  I actually became a bit depressed for a short while because I wanted to feel like that all the time.

Hello purity. That was a great experience. And did the mind stopped thinking? How long did you stayed without thoughts? More than 5 minutes?

purity

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Re: Questions about vipassana
« Reply #3 on: January 28, 2016, 10:39:03 AM »
Hullo,   I achieved some extremely deep Jhana states when on retreat.  Was the most amazing thing that has ever happened to me. One particular experience I had it was like I was floating up and very intense waves of tingling swept over my entire body. Every cell in my body was vibrating and I heard what seemed to be some kind of shamanic chanting.   It was like sex and drugs times a thousand.  I never believed this sort of thing, I am a skeptical type and so I had no idea it could happen until it happened to me.  I was high for days after. I had to let the experience go after that because I could see that it could become a hindrance if I continued to crave for more.  I actually became a bit depressed for a short while because I wanted to feel like that all the time.

Hello purity. That was a great experience. And did the mind stopped thinking? How long did you stayed without thoughts? More than 5 minutes?
Hi Sophia,  one experience it was like the thinking and the pain in my legs were still there but suddenly they were far away like some quiet noise in the distance. The thoughts did not attract me and the pain did not bother me. It's hard to describe. Was kind of like a split. The mind kept going but another part, perhaps awareness?, felt separated from it.   It was a very blissful state.
The other time that I described to you earlier was quite overwhelming and all I can remember is the sensations and at one stage I felt a little bit panicked then it ended. Not sure how long they lasted. Probably only minutes or less but time was completely irrelevant.
« Last Edit: January 28, 2016, 10:42:05 AM by purity »

sophia

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Re: Questions about vipassana
« Reply #4 on: January 28, 2016, 10:45:50 AM »
Hullo,   I achieved some extremely deep Jhana states when on retreat.  Was the most amazing thing that has ever happened to me. One particular experience I had it was like I was floating up and very intense waves of tingling swept over my entire body. Every cell in my body was vibrating and I heard what seemed to be some kind of shamanic chanting.   It was like sex and drugs times a thousand.  I never believed this sort of thing, I am a skeptical type and so I had no idea it could happen until it happened to me.  I was high for days after. I had to let the experience go after that because I could see that it could become a hindrance if I continued to crave for more.  I actually became a bit depressed for a short while because I wanted to feel like that all the time.

Hello purity. That was a great experience. And did the mind stopped thinking? How long did you stayed without thoughts? More than 5 minutes?
Hi Sophia,  one experience it was like the thinking and the pain in my legs were still there but suddenly they were far away like some quiet noise in the distance. The thoughts did not attract me and the pain did not bother me. It's hard to describe. Was kind of like a split. The mind kept going but another part, perhaps awareness?, felt separated from it.   It was a very blissful state.
The other time that I described to you earlier was quite overwhelming and all I can remember is the sensations and at one stage I felt a little bit panicked then it ended. Not sure how long they lasted. Probably only minutes or less but time was completely irrelevant.

And did you still used the labeling? "Rising... " "falling" ?

purity

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Re: Questions about vipassana
« Reply #5 on: January 28, 2016, 11:48:26 AM »
Hullo,   I achieved some extremely deep Jhana states when on retreat.  Was the most amazing thing that has ever happened to me. One particular experience I had it was like I was floating up and very intense waves of tingling swept over my entire body. Every cell in my body was vibrating and I heard what seemed to be some kind of shamanic chanting.   It was like sex and drugs times a thousand.  I never believed this sort of thing, I am a skeptical type and so I had no idea it could happen until it happened to me.  I was high for days after. I had to let the experience go after that because I could see that it could become a hindrance if I continued to crave for more.  I actually became a bit depressed for a short while because I wanted to feel like that all the time.

Hello purity. That was a great experience. And did the mind stopped thinking? How long did you stayed without thoughts? More than 5 minutes?
Hi Sophia,  one experience it was like the thinking and the pain in my legs were still there but suddenly they were far away like some quiet noise in the distance. The thoughts did not attract me and the pain did not bother me. It's hard to describe. Was kind of like a split. The mind kept going but another part, perhaps awareness?, felt separated from it.   It was a very blissful state.
The other time that I described to you earlier was quite overwhelming and all I can remember is the sensations and at one stage I felt a little bit panicked then it ended. Not sure how long they lasted. Probably only minutes or less but time was completely irrelevant.

And did you still used the labeling? "Rising... " "falling" ?

No. The  labelling is something to help you when your concentration is not that good. I usually try to drop it at a certain stage of the meditation and just focus on the sensation or the knowing. But during these occasions it felt like there was nothing but pure awareness. There was no longer any effort involved at all.

sophia

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Re: Questions about vipassana
« Reply #6 on: January 28, 2016, 01:52:46 PM »
Thank you for you shared your meditation experience.

Matthew

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Re: Questions about vipassana
« Reply #7 on: January 29, 2016, 12:57:06 AM »
Shamatha and Vipassana arise as fruits of practice. The Buddha didn't say go do meditation, go do Vipassana or go do Shamatha, he said go do Jhana. Jhana went to China and became Chaan then Japan and became Zen.

Vipassana as taught today is a relatively modern invention, based on interpretations of the Abhidhamma commentaries written years after Buddha died - an exercise in intellectual oneupmanship!

The only reason I steer people to developing Shamatha/calm abiding as a ground of meditation is that modern people are massively concentrated in their heads and practice to develop Shamatha and then Samadhi bring you back to the body and a faster path and more certain path to Jhana.
~oOo~     Tat Tvam Asi     ~oOo~    How will you make the world a better place today?     ~oOo~    Fabricate Nothing     ~oOo~

Matthew

  • The Irreverent Buddhist
  • Member
  • Meditation: It's a D.I.Y. project.
    • KISS: Keep it simple stupid.
    • Getting nowhere slowly and enjoying every moment.
Re: Questions about vipassana
« Reply #8 on: January 29, 2016, 03:12:21 AM »
Quote
The other time that I described to you earlier was quite overwhelming and all I can remember is the sensations and at one stage I felt a little bit panicked then it ended. Not sure how long they lasted. Probably only minutes or less but time was completely irrelevant.

And did you still used the labeling? "Rising... " "falling" ?

No. The  labelling is something to help you when your concentration is not that good. I usually try to drop it at a certain stage of the meditation and just focus on the sensation or the knowing. But during these occasions it felt like there was nothing but pure awareness. There was no longer any effort involved at all.

Labeling is to help kickstart the practice, best dropped as soon as you can maintain awareness without it or it just becomes more habituated thinking:

Quote
Notes: Thoughts will occur. You will suffer "follow-through" thinking so notice when it has happened and your mind has wandered from the sensations in the body as you breathe and calming the body as you breathe, then return the focus of the mind to those sensations and calming the body. When you notice you have got caught in a "train of thoughts", you can, at the beginning, make a mental note of this if you wish: just say "thinking" to yourself in your mind. It is not encouraged to do this for an extended period as it will be a new habit, but for some beginners it helps to "kick-start" the practice.

In the Dhamma,

Matthew
~oOo~     Tat Tvam Asi     ~oOo~    How will you make the world a better place today?     ~oOo~    Fabricate Nothing     ~oOo~

TheJourney

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Re: Questions about vipassana
« Reply #9 on: February 17, 2016, 10:49:06 PM »
Most important practice is to meditate 24/7 minus sleeping hours. Of course when you are not in sitting meditation, your eyes are wide open but you continue to breathe mindfully and the mind is in the state of knowing at all time.

Attaining mindfulness in every second of your life is the path to enlightenment.

Diligence, diligence, diligence.  In the beginning you will forget a lot or get interrupted by train of thoughts but persistence will grow and become a habit for you.

 

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