Author Topic: Levitation while meditating!?  (Read 13139 times)

Re: Levitation while meditating!?
« Reply #25 on: July 01, 2014, 07:28:37 PM »
this forum is getting soo boring............... i hardly remember to visit these days  :D

Quardamon

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Re: Levitation while meditating!?
« Reply #26 on: July 01, 2014, 07:52:47 PM »
 :D     :D     :D   

Matthew

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Re: Levitation while meditating!?
« Reply #27 on: July 01, 2014, 07:55:43 PM »
 "the most essential gift for a good writer is a built-in, shock-proof shit detector. This is the writer’s radar and all great writers have had it.” - Ernest Hemingway.

:D  :o  :'(  ::)  8)
« Last Edit: July 01, 2014, 07:58:33 PM by Matthew »
~oOo~     Tat Tvam Asi     ~oOo~    How will you make the world a better place today?     ~oOo~    Fabricate Nothing     ~oOo~

VinceField

Re: Levitation while meditating!?
« Reply #28 on: July 01, 2014, 10:23:14 PM »
I understand that creating video effects does not lead to liberation.  I also understand that some things can and should simply be enjoyed without having to criticize its perceived significance according to the Dhamma, or falsely construe people of purposefully deceiving others, or take a noticeably aggressive attitude when someone does not see eye to eye with you or when a point you make is refuted.  My initial post (and the youtube description) did not reveal that it was an effect because I wanted the element of surprise to be experienced, as it would add to the enjoyment of the video.  If anyone honestly believed that I intended to trick people into believing that I actually levitated then you must have had a moment of naivety and a lapse of judgement, perhaps due to a lack of insight regarding the purpose of the video and my sharing of it. 

Do you guys actually enjoy things in life and take things lightly or is everything pounded into submission and criticized to the bone through your Dhamma filter?  Can you see the hypocrisy of criticizing perceived egotism in others with a bitter, harsh and negative attitude that is so clearly born from egotism?  DT says that I lack the insight that is central to this forum, and yet I would never behave or speak to another person the way Matthew has spoken to me here.  I left the negative reactions of my ego behind when I began to find real inner peace and harmony through my spiritual practices and wholesome mental and physical activity.  Any perception of being "poked" or instigated is nothing more than a delusion of the ego taking phenomenon personally and is likewise contradictory to the preaching taking place here, not to mention simply not applicable, as I haven't even hinted at anything that could even be remotely construed as a personal jab at anyone here.
 
I have not received a harsh or critical response from anyone else on any other forum.  In fact, elsewhere people probably just as studied and practiced in Buddhism as anyone else here have either had something positive to say or did not see the need to say anything at all.  Are the thousands of members of these other forums neglecting to impart helpful insight to me, or are they simply balanced enough to understand purpose and nature the video without needing to construe something negative out of it and not react from their ego due to attachment or aversion to their perceptions of the kind of person they think I am?  I think some people here need to lighten up.  I'm as light as a feather baby and it feels good!   :D
« Last Edit: July 01, 2014, 10:31:22 PM by VinceField »

Quardamon

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Re: Levitation while meditating!?
« Reply #29 on: July 01, 2014, 11:10:00 PM »
I have not received a harsh or critical response from anyone else on any other forum.

That is not so:
From http://www.dhammawheel.com/viewtopic.php?f=16&t=21031&start=100:

Quote
Re: Where is God in Buddhism?

Postby SDC » Fri Jun 20, 2014 8:58 pm

    VinceField wrote:It's all about.....

Like I said two pages ago, if you had an axe to grind or even just a simple bone to pick regarding conduct on religious forums then it should have been said outright rather than under the guise of a topic such as “God” of which you knew full well how it was likely to go. Your digression into this borderline self-righteous analysis regarding the conduct of the membership is so blatantly pre-planned and devious.

Thanks for stopping by, and you stay classy, San Diego.


Some serious decisions may need to be made. We've been here before and it was a drawn out exercise in futility.
I agree.
I am not a vegetarian. I eat meat twice a week. I just want the beings that I eat to have had a good life.
I think, Vincent, that you are enjoying your life. You do not need me, and I do not need you. I do not want to be part of your game.
As for me: Farewell.

Matthew

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Re: Levitation while meditating!?
« Reply #30 on: July 01, 2014, 11:24:44 PM »
Vince,

You ask, "Do you guys actually enjoy things in life and take things lightly or is everything pounded into submission and criticized to the bone through your Dhamma filter?". There are many things in life I enjoy and take lightly, I love to be in nature, to see the plants growing, the great diversity of animals, birds and insects doing there thing. I play harmonica and sing: last night I met two French mandolin players and jammed with them and sung songs made up on the spot with a friend on the piano. I love cooking fresh food and sharing with friends.

I used to be very physically active, playing football, snowboarding, swimming an hour a day and working out in the gym then running in the evenings. However, in 2004 I injured my neck and have progressively lost control of muscles in the back of my body. This has lead to atrophy, respiratory problems and more. It is now an acute problem and there has been a wholesale failure by the medical profession to investigate and deal with the injury and consequences. I find this very hard. At the moment it is leading to a lack of equanimity as daily survival is getting harder and pain levels are increasing.

I see that this lack of equanimity is due to fear of what may become due to my physical injuries - and the injustice offered to me by the "health system" in the name of medicine. I also see that, at times, this lack of equanimity has "leaked" into other activities including my posting on this forum.

I am sorry that I did not take time to choose wiser words. You seem like a good person. DT points out that you do not seem to be connected to the fundamental insights the practice-base of forum members are working with and I think there is some truth in this. I do not think you intended to truly deceive with this video but there are very many impressionable people out there and we all have a responsibility to help others awaken with whatever level of insight and wisdom we have. In this regard I don't think you chose the wisest way to publish this video. I agree with the sentiments you expressed about government crimes and I spend time in my daily life trying to help educate people about the nature of such things. I think we are on the cusp of either a great revolution toward a just and fairer and more informed society or toward a highly manipulated totalitarian world run by and for the benefit of a small oligarchic elite. I work for the former outcome.

This forum, it's existence and form are a part of that effort: inner transformation must precede outer transformation. The Buddhist "three root poisons" of ignorance, greed and aversion can clearly be seen as great drivers of the vast inequalities in today's world. For this reason I do not take the Dhamma lightly: I see it as having great transformative potential and have committed myself to the Dhamma because from experience I have found truth in the teachings of the Buddha.

Sometimes some of the greatest lessons on this forum are learned from some of the seemingly most difficult discussions. I don't think we should shy away from these. I also see it as imperative that endless speculation on unresolvable issues is to be avoided: they seem to lead to difficult discussions where little is learned.

Please accept my unreserved apologies for my unwise words and unwholesome speech directed at you.

Matthew
~oOo~     Tat Tvam Asi     ~oOo~    How will you make the world a better place today?     ~oOo~    Fabricate Nothing     ~oOo~

VinceField

Re: Levitation while meditating!?
« Reply #31 on: July 02, 2014, 12:44:30 AM »
Matthew

I appreciate and accept your apology.  I would likewise like to offer my apologies to you, the other members here, and to myself for engaging in any conversations that were not born from wholesome motivations or that did not contain wholesome content.  I knew that you had a condition and I have kept this in mind when attempting to discern the motivations and influencing factors of some of your posts.  I sometimes get sucked into defending myself or my views when they are challenged, when I know that I should simply let things be.  Sometimes I do so to genuinely attempt to broaden the perspectives of others when I believe I have information or experience that others seem to lack which may be of service, but at the same time I am programmed to stand my ground and speak my mind and this is sometimes difficult to overcome.

I don't want to seem like I am purposefully causing friction here, or that I am not suitable for this discussion board.  I believe I have a decent understanding of the main teachings of Buddhism and I try to exemplify them in my daily life in addition to my daily meditation practices.  This could be confirmed by my family and friends, as I see someone here is keen on researching my claims.  I'll give you their numbers if you need verification.  Just kidding.  But between reading books and listening to audio talks in the car on my daily commute to work I spend hours a day engaged in learning and contemplating the practices and philosophies that this message board is founded on. 

Sure there are some aspects of the teachings that don't seem to fit into the realm of experiences that I've had with other lines of spiritual practice, and there are aspects of the teachings that I haven't personally experienced and so am not totally convinced of,  but I don't think I should be condemned for this.  I personally enjoy and believe it is oftentimes beneficial and enriching to hear experiences and perspectives of individuals coming from different paths and practices. 

My point in saying all of this is that I agree with what you stated the purpose of this forum is, as well as the importance and potential of the dhamma.  There is rarely a thought I make or an action I take these days that is not held in light of these teachings. 

I would be very interested in hearing what exactly you think my disconnect is with the fundamental insights of the practices and philosophies of the other forum members here.  Aside from some notions that I don't think anyone here has confirmed through experience (such as the nature of God or the idea that a true self doesn't exist), I haven't noticed much difference in understanding.  Maybe you can bring something to my attention that I am missing.

Quardamon

You seem to have taken some things out of context.  Firstly, I was referring to the levitation video I posted when I said that I have not received any other harsh responses.  Sorry if I didn't make that more clear.    Secondly, if you had continued reading the thread about God that you extracted the quote from in which I was criticized, you would have seen that the poster misunderstood me and later admitted his faulty interpretation of my post.  But I appreciate how important my posts and I must be to you for you to be inspired to go out of your way to research my claims on other forums.  You're making me blush!  :-*
« Last Edit: July 02, 2014, 12:50:12 AM by VinceField »

Dharmic Tui

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Re: Levitation while meditating!?
« Reply #32 on: July 02, 2014, 01:00:56 AM »
Vince, I’m parroting Matthew a little but I guess the long and the short of it is there’s two sort of posters we get;

- ones with a genuine interest in insight/Vipassana meditation who “get” it in rough terms
- people who have a sort of attraction to a more generalised form of meditation but ultimately are still a bit caught up in themselves, who don’t like answering harder questions honestly, and cry “you’re obviously no fun” when others don’t appreciate them trying to steer things towards their own subjective requirements. Usually this type becomes more and more entrenched in behavior that elicits a negative reaction from others.

I like to give people the benefit of the doubt but you do seem to be running true to form to one of those types. I guess it’s up to you whether you want to continue along the lines of “this is who I am and what I want to do and you need to accept me” or maybe consider a different approach. The different approach may benefit you in many other areas. I guess the challenge is you have some rather contrasting beliefs you are trying to somehow reconcile.

VinceField

Re: Levitation while meditating!?
« Reply #33 on: July 02, 2014, 01:32:27 AM »
Quote
ultimately are still a bit caught up in themselves, who don’t like answering harder questions honestly, and cry “you’re obviously no fun” when others don’t appreciate them trying to steer things towards their own subjective requirements.

Like I requested of Matthew, if you can provide some examples- actually, as many as you can conjure up- so I have a better understanding of your perspective of me and can better recognize things that I may need to work on, that would be appreciated.

Quote
Usually this type becomes more and more entrenched in behavior that elicits a negative reaction from others.

The irony here is that negative reactions are a direct result of being caught up in oneself and embodying characteristics which go against Buddhist teachings.  Reactions can sometimes speak louder than their cause.

Quote
I guess it’s up to you whether you want to continue along the lines of “this is who I am and what I want to do and you need to accept me” or maybe consider a different approach.

I don't request that anyone accepts me, although I do try to convey my thoughts so that I am understood.  I accept myself and I am content with that.  I presently can't conceive of a better alternative to approach life and the bigger concepts that are dealt with in these philosophies and practices.  I have reasonable faith based on previous results of myself and others, my beliefs are not rigid or set in stone but rather mostly influenced by my personal experiences but are open to change, I am not limited to just one body or system of belief but am developing through various traditions and practices to ensure an unbiased and more holistic learning, development, and perspective, and I strive to remain mindful of my thoughts and actions as to exemplify wholesome values and characteristics in order to improve myself and develop spiritually along the very lines taught in Buddhism, which includes releasing attachments and lessening the influence of ego.  If you have any suggestions as to ways I can improve my approach I am open to hear them.  Thanks.

Dharmic Tui

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Re: Levitation while meditating!?
« Reply #34 on: July 02, 2014, 09:10:42 AM »
Like I requested of Matthew, if you can provide some examples- actually, as many as you can conjure up- so I have a better understanding of your perspective of me and can better recognize things that I may need to work on, that would be appreciated.
For the sake of other people reading this thread/forum I'm not going to do that. If you are genuinely interested drop me a PM and I can go into it if you wish.
Quote
The irony here is that negative reactions are a direct result of being caught up in oneself and embodying characteristics which go against Buddhist teachings.  Reactions can sometimes speak louder than their cause.
I was talking typically about the person soliciting for such reactions. I don't consider what I've said to you negative (or positive, for that matter), however after maybe my 2nd ever post to you claimed my posting was negative (not that exact word, but don't have the energy to wade back through posts).
Quote
If you have any suggestions as to ways I can improve my approach I am open to hear them.  Thanks.
Your approach is as you have said; an eclectic mix of whatever takes hold (I'm paraphrasing there) including some dualism elements which are at odds with some of the core principles here. I can't do much in the way of suggestions in that regard, because that's how you've chosen to undertake your spiritual path (or whatever you want to call it).

Middleway

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Re: Levitation while meditating!?
« Reply #35 on: July 02, 2014, 01:31:59 PM »
Vincefield, both Matthew and DT raised this issue but you did not answer. Did you really experience god as you have described in your other posts?
Take everything I say with a grain of salt.

Matthew

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Re: Levitation while meditating!?
« Reply #36 on: July 02, 2014, 03:33:13 PM »
Vincefield, both Matthew and DT raised this issue but you did not answer. Did you really experience god as you have described in your other posts?

Middleway,

He experienced something he chooses to call "God". His descriptions of "God" have been contradictory and are no indication that he experienced "God" though I do not doubt he believes he did.

Asking these questions falls into the realm of unanswerable questions unlikely to lead to beneficial conversation or knowledge by their very nature.

Can prove "God" exists? - Answer, No.
Can prove "God" does not exist? - Answer No.

These are the types of questions the Buddha warned against because they lead to clinging to views and to "a thicket of views" - all of which get in the way of experiencing the now of now.

Kindly,

Matthew
~oOo~     Tat Tvam Asi     ~oOo~    How will you make the world a better place today?     ~oOo~    Fabricate Nothing     ~oOo~

Middleway

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Re: Levitation while meditating!?
« Reply #37 on: July 02, 2014, 05:18:11 PM »
Matthew,

I was not referring to god as an issue. I know where I stand on that and made myself very clear in my posts relating that issue. Vincefield has shown tendency to manipulate people and what they said on his videos. This has raised a question whether he is being truthful in his posts regarding his experiences.

Middleway
Take everything I say with a grain of salt.

VinceField

Re: Levitation while meditating!?
« Reply #38 on: July 02, 2014, 05:25:49 PM »
Vincefield, both Matthew and DT raised this issue but you did not answer. Did you really experience god as you have described in your other posts?

I don't quite understand your question, or at least why you are asking it.  I clearly described what I experienced, and simply called it "God" for lack of a better word, as the experience fit certain definitions of what God is among certain systems of belief.  The details of the experience are there to be read.  Forget I even used the word God, as that might lead to preconceived notions about the experience or my interpretation of it, and just read the experience for what it is.  I have no problem chucking the word God.  The truth is in the experience, not the labeling of it.  All of this has already been covered in that thread buddy.

It seems you are asking here if I was telling the truth when I described my experiences, which is rather bizarre, as I don't believe I have exhibited any behavior that would make one think I was a liar.  I have nothing to gain by making up stories or inventing experiences, and I don't believe Matthew or DT even came close to insinuating this so I am not sure where you are coming from with your post pal. 

Edit:

Quote
Vincefield has shown tendency to manipulate people and what they said on his videos. This has raised a question whether he is being truthful in his posts regarding his experiences.

LOL That is a far stretch from reality buddy. 
« Last Edit: July 02, 2014, 05:43:18 PM by VinceField »

Dharmic Tui

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Re: Levitation while meditating!?
« Reply #39 on: July 02, 2014, 06:45:32 PM »
From your reality maybe.

Tobin

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Re: Levitation while meditating!?
« Reply #40 on: July 02, 2014, 07:58:07 PM »
I think the whole God issue has been dealt with. As Matthew stated, as well as the Buddha himself and from what can clearly be seen in these threads, is that the topic is heated and frivolous.

As far as this particular thread goes, it has gotten out of hand. Maybe this should have been part of the off-topic forum categories. I personally saw the humor in it and didn't take it for any more then that.

Vince, I understand you have over a decade of experience with meditation, but you've also stated yourself that you're new to insight styles. If you're here to butt heads, I'm sure you'll quickly find your way out the door, but if you're here as a beginner like me, we both have to understand that we are the newbies and we came here to learn. There is a wealth of information from some pretty amazing people on this forum. Don't waste it!
Regards,
Tobin

Matthew

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Re: Levitation while meditating!?
« Reply #41 on: July 02, 2014, 08:53:32 PM »
Matthew,

I was not referring to god as an issue. I know where I stand on that and made myself very clear in my posts relating that issue. Vincefield has shown tendency to manipulate people and what they said on his videos. This has raised a question whether he is being truthful in his posts regarding his experiences.

Middleway

Apologies, misunderstood.

Matthew
~oOo~     Tat Tvam Asi     ~oOo~    How will you make the world a better place today?     ~oOo~    Fabricate Nothing     ~oOo~

Middleway

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Re: Levitation while meditating!?
« Reply #42 on: July 03, 2014, 12:57:39 AM »

Apologies, misunderstood.

Matthew

No need for an apology Matthew. I was trying to be brief and direct with my question.
Take everything I say with a grain of salt.

Middleway

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Re: Levitation while meditating!?
« Reply #43 on: July 03, 2014, 01:12:39 AM »
Vincefield, you said you have been pursuing the spiritual path for the last 10 years or more. Making light of holocaust albeit to prove a point in movie editing comes from an unwholesome mind. The experiences you described you had are only possible if one let's go off ego completely. Based on your posts on this forum, it is obvious that your ego is 100 percent intact, alive and kicking. Either you must be hallucinating in which case you may want to go to a psychiatrist an get help or you are a fraud. The latter is more likely closer to the truth.
Take everything I say with a grain of salt.

Middleway

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Re: Levitation while meditating!?
« Reply #44 on: July 03, 2014, 01:17:47 AM »
Tobin, I did not want this thread to end with a bully getting respectability from Matthew's apology. 
Take everything I say with a grain of salt.

VinceField

Re: Levitation while meditating!?
« Reply #45 on: July 03, 2014, 02:01:24 AM »
Well, someone doesn't like me very much!   ???

I only care to comment on your statement that the experiences I have described are only possible if one is free of ego. 

This is simply not true.  Anyone can learn to navigate in the out of body state, big egos and small alike.  It's really more about technique than it is about one's level of spiritual development, at least at first.  However, to get to the higher dimensions one needs to refine one's subtle energy body system so that one can attune to the higher energies that comprise these higher realms.  This refinement happens naturally with experience, although it can be further assisted by energy work (manipulating the body's subtle energies or chi to remove blockages and raise one's internal vibrational state) and by removing limiting belief systems, negative tendencies, and attachments which keep a person in a lower vibratory state. 

Many individuals have reported similar experiences and experiences that even go beyond the limits of my own, and these people are not Buddhas but normal individuals with their own particular attachments like any of us here.  I am not sure what your source is for making this statement, and I'm likewise unsure what I did to earn the title "bully," but I believe you are mistaken on both accounts my friend.  I don't mind being called a fraud, but I thought I would inform you that your theoretical basis for this claim is false.   

I wish you peace, love and harmony, even if you do not wish it upon me. 
« Last Edit: July 03, 2014, 02:03:43 AM by VinceField »

Middleway

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Re: Levitation while meditating!?
« Reply #46 on: July 03, 2014, 03:29:13 AM »
Well, someone doesn't like me very much!   ???

I only care to comment on your statement that the experiences I have described are only possible if one is free of ego. 

This is simply not true.  Anyone can learn to navigate in the out of body state, big egos and small alike.  It's really more about technique than it is about one's level of spiritual development, at least at first.  However, to get to the higher dimensions one needs to refine one's subtle energy body system so that one can attune to the higher energies that comprise these higher realms.  This refinement happens naturally with experience, although it can be further assisted by energy work (manipulating the body's subtle energies or chi to remove blockages and raise one's internal vibrational state) and by removing limiting belief systems, negative tendencies, and attachments which keep a person in a lower vibratory state. 

Many individuals have reported similar experiences and experiences that even go beyond the limits of my own, and these people are not Buddhas but normal individuals with their own particular attachments like any of us here.  I am not sure what your source is for making this statement, and I'm likewise unsure what I did to earn the title "bully," but I believe you are mistaken on both accounts my friend.  I don't mind being called a fraud, but I thought I would inform you that your theoretical basis for this claim is false.   

I wish you peace, love and harmony, even if you do not wish it upon me. 

Vincefield, I don’t know you personally to either like you or dislike you. I certainly dislike this thing called “ego” that I am trying to get rid off myself.
 
Looks like you and I agree on one thing…you are so full of it. Several members have warned you or brought this to your attention with little success. I have myself gently reminded you at least on two occasions. I asked you to contemplate on the audacity with which you made a certain statement. Your ego wouldn’t pay attention. I reminded you that the religions you were trashing were founded on the basis of thousands of enlightened individuals; again your ego would not listen. You yourself have admitted that you started reading about “no-self” concept a few days ago and then you brazenly expressed your opinion criticizing widely accepted views on the subject.
 
After your explanation in the quotes above, now I am fully convinced what you have experienced are hallucinations by employing mind altering techniques. These are temporary states of mind that produce experiences that are qualitatively different than regular states of consciousness. These experiences don’t lead you anywhere other than inflating your ego.

What we are practicing here is to let go off our ego which leads us to stream entry and then onto Nibbana. Your mind altering techniques are of no use to me or any of the members of this forum.  You don't need 14 years to get to where you are. Try psychedelic drugs, you will there in 15 minutes. You have wasted 14 years of your time and now you are wasting our time. Please cease and desist these off-topic conversations and contemplate on your ego.
« Last Edit: July 03, 2014, 03:36:16 AM by Middleway »
Take everything I say with a grain of salt.

Tobin

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Re: Levitation while meditating!?
« Reply #47 on: July 03, 2014, 06:30:54 AM »
Tobin, I did not want this thread to end with a bully getting respectability from Matthew's apology.

I don't think there was ever any fear of that Middleway.
Regards,
Tobin

VinceField

Re: Levitation while meditating!?
« Reply #48 on: July 03, 2014, 06:37:59 AM »
Middleway

I hope you are happy that you are now receiving some attention from me.  I didn't pay your previous comments any mind because either the question you raised had already been addressed (as was the case with your first post on my thread about God), or your comment was an absolutely absurd exaggeration of reality (as was the case with your second post on the same thread).  The fact that you took my statement "My personal opinion is that no religion contains complete truth" and contorted it into accusing me of "trashing" other religions and insinuating that I disrespected "thousands of enlightened people" displayed just how unbalanced your view is, and frankly I didn't feel the need to waste my time responding to that.

I am also rather bewildered as to how you went from telling me "you are far advanced in the path than I am at this point in time. I can only dream of the stage you have achieved thus far." and sending me "warm regards," to essentially attacking me, claiming that my experiences are invalid, that I am "so full of it," and somehow labeling me as a "bully."  And I am rather amused at your statement "you don't need 14 years to get to where you are" as if you have any idea of who I am, what I do or what the quality of my life is.  The fact of the matter is that you lack the knowledge, experience and insight to discern whether my spiritual experiences are valid and what the results of them have been in my life. 

If you think that not conforming to every aspect of the Buddhist belief system makes me an egomaniac then you must have overlooked the Buddha's teaching of not taking his word as ultimate truth but experiencing the truth for oneself. 

It is also rather clear that your desire to say these things to me is born from your ego and you have no intention of being of service to anyone but yourself.  Criticizing. slandering and negating another person and their experiences as you have just done is inharmonious speech and undoubtedly a product of the aversions and attachments of an unruly ego.  I say this not to criticize you but to simply bring this to your attention, as oftentimes we are unknowingly victims of our own hypocrisy, so maybe give a good ponder into the reasons for you saying these things to me and what attachments and aversions arise when doing so.  Good luck.

Re: Levitation while meditating!?
« Reply #49 on: July 03, 2014, 10:13:45 AM »
Can you all plz STFU  ???

i would love it if moderators will close this topic.

 

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