Ambitions, motivation, goals, life experience...

[Skanzi]

Hi there,

I'm just wondering how you guys look on values like ambition. Working towards something. Perhaps improving your career, enhancing your relations with others, inspiring more people, promotion, giving more value to the world, writing a book, making a trip around the world, camping in a forest for a week, supporting medical agencies in third world countries, climb the mount everest, raising awareness for illegal logging, competing in the toughest marathon on earth...

Just basically all those ideas, ambitions, goals. How do you guys who are highly involved with vipassana and meditations retreats look at something like that. Because, what i've learned is that it's important to be present, not constantly strive and look for things that you think will make you happy, let go and enjoy the moment. With all these ambitions in mind, you're not really being present, are you? You are looking for things that will enhance your life experience, but you are not living your life at the moment when you do that, or am I wrong?

And do you veteran meditators have any ambitions? Or is your daily life just routine? Not saying routine has to be bad, but are you working towards something and trying to achieve something bigger or do you have nothing in mind at all and just living life from moment to moment?

How do you guys look at this? Personally, i don't think i'd be able to not have any ambition in mind. Otherwise life would be too boring for me even if i'd try to be present all the time. It'd kill any motivation for me.

[siddharthgode]

K one basic rule:

All desires turning to craving are bad.

Working towards something. Perhaps improving your career, enhancing your relations with others, inspiring more people, promotion, giving more value to the world, writing a book, making a trip around the world, camping in a forest for a week, supporting medical agencies in third world countries, climb the mount everest, raising awareness for illegal logging, competing in the toughest marathon on earth...

There is no hurting of others in these desires so all good.

But one has to understand that by achieving any of the above, it would be pleasurable and it would make one happy, then he really is chasing after pleasure and happiness. Is he not?
If yes then can one see that this happiness is temporary ? If so then whats the point of working so hard of climbing a mount everest and get a pleasure of few days from it? it will be lost and Was it worth it? i am back where i was. Its a circular process.
I would say it was not worth it, its better to study this pleasure and happiness than run behind it in circles.

But if one desires to do the above from the love of others and love for our planet and not expecting pleasure from it then very good.

[Dharmic Tui]

This does seem a paradox from a beginner point of view, but I have rationalised ambition from the perspective that I don't spend lots of time dwelling on making decisions for the future and being better, nor lamenting decisions in the past. Instead I make decisions from a point of relative clarity, and enact those decisions using a great deal of concentration. I spend a lot more time doing things than thinking about them which allows me to accomplish more with a greater degree of skill, without getting caught up worrying about the outcome or what might be around the corner.

[redalert]

I'm just wondering how you guys look on values like ambition. Working towards something. Perhaps improving your career ....

After self-realization, you simply go on with day to day tasks, but you know that any-thing is not going to define you.

How do you guys who are highly involved with vipassana and meditations retreats look at something like that. Because, what i've learned is that it's important to be present, not constantly strive and look for things that you think will make you happy, let go and enjoy the moment. With all these ambitions in mind, you're not really being present, are you? You are looking for things that will enhance your life experience, but you are not living your life at the moment when you do that, or am I wrong?

You are to cultivate awareness 24/7 for me it is continuity of what does it feel like to be Redalert at this moment, from moment to moment. This is not always the case, we get caught up in thought trains and let them go, then get caught and let them go. We have disagreements and Ego's are known to flare up on retreats and you just try to observe and remain aware and let go in a natural way. I think a lot of people think you are to act a certain way once you begin this practice but I feel this will end in suppression. This is why serving on retreats is very beneficial, you can witness a wide array of meditators with different levels of experience living and working face to face.

I have also done work on the Vihara centre I go to and have taken the senior monk on trips to the Home Depot where he purchased the building materials for the renovation I was doing for them. Really wonderful to observe him as we shopped, and dealt with the credit card machine not working. He is a really peaceful man.

Or is your daily life just routine?

I try to stick to a routine, but with a busy family life, this is not always the case. My wife and I are currently working to save some money to put an addition on our home(growing family), and we have bought tickets to an all inclusive resort in Costa Rica for March break.

[Matthew]

Hi Skanzi,

I'm just wondering how you guys look on values like ambition. ...

...How do you guys who are highly involved with vipassana and meditations retreats look at something like that. Because, what i've learned is that it's important to be present, not constantly strive and look for things that you think will make you happy, let go and enjoy the moment. With all these ambitions in mind, you're not really being present, are you?

No, you're not present because ambition comes from desire which is based in the lie we tell ourselves about "who we are".

You are looking for things that will enhance your life experience, but you are not living your life at the moment when you do that, or am I wrong?

You are right.

And do you veteran meditators have any ambitions?

It takes a very serious commitment to the path and much time to de-construct the self to the point where ambition disappears completely. I'm not there and I doubt many people you will meet in the world of Buddhism/Meditation are there.

Or is your daily life just routine?

Right now I am in a place with my meditation where life is far from routine, yet I certainly live with some structure, for example going to bed at 9pm is something I have learned is right for me - any later I will not sleep well or will pay for it later.

When I am out and about and not in "doing/thinking" mode but in "knowing/being" mode (one of my principle meditative practices at this point in time) there is no sense of time, there is no sense of separation from the world around me. Life becomes incredibly spontaneous.

Not saying routine has to be bad, but are you working towards something and trying to achieve something bigger or do you have nothing in mind at all and just living life from moment to moment?

It all depends where you are at on the path, if you're following the path. If you are seeking full enlightenment the answer to this question will be different from a person who is seeking to use meditation to help manage depression. It also depends on how deeply one understands the path ... for some they may believe they are seeking full enlightenment yet actually they have just incorporated the path into their ego, for others where deeper insight into the nature of reality has arisen and there is a wholehearted commitment to the path there will likely be much more "living moment to moment".

How do you guys look at this? Personally, i don't think i'd be able to not have any ambition in mind. Otherwise life would be too boring for me even if i'd try to be present all the time. It'd kill any motivation for me.

How do you know this? - I would suggest you don't - how could you unless you had reached the end of the path? .. Something none of us has done at this moment in time.

Kindly,

Matthew

[Obol]

My current take on this (as someone starting a career, with goals including a couple of the ones you mentioned) derives from that zen proverb:

'Before enlightenment, chop wood and carry water,
After enlightenment, chop wood and carry water.'

So as that applies to our modern life, I guess its something along the lines of:

'Before enlightenment, perform tasks and measure results,
After enlightenment, perform tasks and measure results.'

Do you think this is valid?