Author Topic: Help with Access Concentration!  (Read 11601 times)

Jhana Seeker

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Help with Access Concentration!
« on: November 23, 2011, 08:14:25 AM »
I´ve a huge problem when meditating or trying to meditate. I´ve been trying for over 3 years on and off without ANY gains. I´ve gotten knee pains, mental irritations and bad mood of all the time spent without anything happen with my ability to meditate. Now I´ve changed my way to sit and now I don´t have any knee pains anymore and the pose is no longer a problem but the meditation is far from better, it maybe even be getting worse by time because I seem to be able to sit less and less time before my mind gets distracted and I end up just sitting and thinking about other things with my eyes open.
That´s my problem.

My goal is to reach Jhana. I do want all the benefits from meditation but my main goal is the state of Jhana and the pure clarity it brings afterwards from what I´ve read. I´m a truth seeker and I want the Jhanas to be one of my intruments to seek and understand truths. From all of what I´ve read about the Jhanas it sure must be a powerful thing and this is something I must be able to master!
I´m a athlete and I train my body everyday and I also want to train my mind but that seems to be the hardest thing to train, at least for me, why is that? Just sitting down, relax and concentrate on my breath for an half an hour doesn´t sound that difficult but to be able to actually do it seems almost impossible!

I have tried so many different meditation techniques, guided meditations and most of them often work very well the first times I test them and I´m able to follow my breath for long period of times without interruptions but then it´s back to the same wandering of again. My mind seems to have a very strong and powerfull will to do what ever it want and I can´t do much about it. I need to tame this beast but I don´t know how and I feel I have tried it all so please can someone who have had a hard time attaining access conscentration share your wisdom of how to master it insted of being a slave to it. I just want to be able to focus my attention on my breath when I want to but I can´t manage such a simple task! It´s very embarrassing especially after been trying for so many years!

Please!
Anyone who have had the same problems I describe and have been able to overcome them, can you please help me to come over this huge mountain (access concentration) so I can move towards the Jhanas? I really don´t need to know what you´ve read but your own experience and what worked for you. All I need to know is how to attain access concentration and then I will get used to and master that before I start seeking Jhana. But I need to have clear and simple information in layman terms and maybe even a good technique to attain access concentration and all help I can get is highly appreciated! I´m in great need!

Thank´s for reading this!

Andrew

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Re: Help with Access Concentration!
« Reply #1 on: November 23, 2011, 01:10:04 PM »
Hello Jhana Seeker,

Welcome.

I too was in your situation as far as wanting to have this experience called 'jhana' for it's own sake. It took a lot of patience of those around here over the last 10 or so months to show me slowly that infact truth seeking starts right now, not after some experience.

I won't try and advice you on jhana as I cannot definitively say what I have experienced from time to time is access concentration or not, but I have found that the daily practice of calm-abiding meditation has a power which when coupled with daily mindfulness and seeking answers as you are doing here, have alot of the benefits you currently imagine lie on the other side of jhanas.

I can sympathize with your state of mind in this as I 'tried' for 8 years to land jhanas or some other spectacular meditative achievement, it was a burning ache in me.

Perhaps you will be able to hear me when I say that you are infact right now in a state of concentration and insight, a very light one, as you read these words. The state written about in books and talked about in forums is infact an extension of the very thing you are doing right now.

So just like reading, you begin to learn to let go of such goals and take in what is right infront of you, which in formal meditation is whatever comes up next. The breath just happens to be handy.

Perhaps you can let us know more about how you go about your practice on and of the cushion and we can help with the truth seeking you desire.

regards

Andrew
getting it done

Matthew

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Re: Help with Access Concentration!
« Reply #2 on: November 23, 2011, 01:24:46 PM »
Meditation is a state of being not doing
Trying too hard ensures failure
Setting goals delivers misery and suffering
Wanting is not meditation
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Anand

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Re: Help with Access Concentration!
« Reply #3 on: November 23, 2011, 06:00:52 PM »
Hello Jhana seeker.

I 100% agree with Matthew.setting goals in meditation is negating the  process itself. You said you get bored and then get up in the middle ...There you are..reacting to the sensation.where as you simply have to observe your boredom and not react to it.you are an athlete so you can handle physical pain easily.remember that rest everything is nothing but manifestation of your mind..use your wisdom here and you will be okay.
also keep on contemplating off the cushion..believe me it helps a lot to better your on cushion sessions.

Jhana Seeker

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Re: Help with Access Concentration!
« Reply #4 on: November 24, 2011, 05:26:51 AM »
Thanks for giving time to reply!

I will try to make my question more simple and understandable.

Is here anyone who have successfully attained Access Concentration? Would you be kind to give me instuctons in as simple english as possible that can only be understood in one way.

Only instructions to attain Access Concentration. Can you please leave out everything else from this tread. Only instructions, if no one have personal experiences on how to attain Access Concentration that´s fine but please don´t post a reply in this thread, I only need intructions. There is nothing new you can tell me that I have not read many times before. The only thing I have not read is good intructions on how to accually attain access concentration.

What do I need to do? I will do whatever it takes, I just need to know what to do!

I have read about teachers who can teach new meditators to attain jhana in a 10 day retreat, others in a month but that´s quick! It shouldn´t be so hard if you only know how?

Is here anyone who have instructions to attain Access Concentration?

Thank you!
« Last Edit: November 24, 2011, 05:29:45 AM by Jhana Seeker »

Matthew

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Re: Help with Access Concentration!
« Reply #5 on: November 24, 2011, 07:41:51 PM »
http://www.vipassanaforum.net/forum/index.php/page,10.html

You try too hard. Do you know how to relax?

How do you practice?
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Andrew

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Re: Help with Access Concentration!
« Reply #6 on: November 25, 2011, 12:49:12 AM »
http://7meditations.com/introduce-your-self/523-hi-help.html

Do you put into practice this advice, or reject it like you have here?

You already stated the instructions, the only instructions there truly are; sit, breath, relax.

Have a close look at what you are asking for, and you will see why you are getting the results you are.

By the way, we are not so simple that you needed to restate your question, like I mentioned I know the question well, everyone who has ever sat down to meditation knows  it;

 "How can I get free?, how can I get relief?"

If you want the traditional instructions they are posted everywhere you look.

When you realise that you are unable to do it (it seems impossible), like Brett said on 7 Meditations, look into your mind and sort out what is coming up.

It really is the whole point of it in the first place.

So what does come up when you sit down? Have a close look at it, when it is sorted out you will be closer to understanding your own question first.

You indeed hold the answer to why you find it impossible to be alone with yourself for 30 mins.



 


« Last Edit: November 25, 2011, 12:53:48 AM by Andrew »
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Vivek

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Re: Help with Access Concentration!
« Reply #7 on: November 25, 2011, 08:32:03 AM »
Quote
Is here anyone who have successfully attained Access Concentration? Would you be kind to give me instuctons in as simple english as possible that can only be understood in one way.
Hi, I think all the help that we could provide, have been already provided to you. I don't think there is anything more to add. Maybe, what you are looking for is not here? This forum focusses mainly on Vipassana, so, you may not get much if all you are looking for is Jhana experience. I hope this is clear enough. No offence meant.

May you attain what you really need.

Let's go beyond this illusion, shall we?

Matthew

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Re: Help with Access Concentration!
« Reply #8 on: November 25, 2011, 11:40:04 PM »
Vivek,

I would not be so fast to put Jhana Seeker off. He may soon realise that it is something else he seeks entirely, once the blindfold starts falling away.

Matthew
~oOo~     Tat Tvam Asi     ~oOo~    How will you make the world a better place today?     ~oOo~    Fabricate Nothing     ~oOo~

Jhana Seeker

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Re: Help with Access Concentration!
« Reply #9 on: December 20, 2011, 08:40:39 AM »
http://www.vipassanaforum.net/forum/index.php/page,10.html

You try too hard. Do you know how to relax?

How do you practice?
I will read through that article, thanks.

My practice start by sitting down and taking a few deep breaths. Then I start with the technique I use which usually is counting the breaths and then I do this for about 20 minutes. I have tried shorter time and longer time and shorter time works much better and I will from now on go back to that and work my way up. I read about 20-30 minutes so often so I have started to believe that it has to be so but I will do what I feel is right for me and work my way up.

http://7meditations.com/introduce-your-self/523-hi-help.html

Do you put into practice this advice, or reject it like you have here?
I did not reject that info. But I have to admit I did not understand it.

You already stated the instructions, the only instructions there truly are; sit, breath, relax.
Well, the thing is I do not feel any progress at all, it rather feels like my mind gets more and more stressed the more I sit. My mind wonder faster and faster insted of the other way around.

By the way, we are not so simple that you needed to restate your question, like I mentioned I know the question well, everyone who has ever sat down to meditation knows  it;

 "How can I get free?, how can I get relief?"
I did ask a little bit different because I did not want to mix jhana and access concentration. I felt that I did wrong to mention jhana when the question wasn't about jhana and I didn't want any answers about jhana. I wanted people to be mindfull of my question and not get lost in my info or my forum name so I tried to cut out as much distractions as possible. Access Concentation is the only thing right now that I need to learn, I see that as the first step in meditation and everything before that is preperation for this 1st step. I can't reach the first step and I wanted instructions from people who had reached this step and maybe could help me get there too.

If you want the traditional instructions they are posted everywhere you look.
That hasn't helped me yet. I would rather get instructions from someone I can ask questions to if needed. When I monk is to learn how to meditate he needs a teacher and even with a good munk as a teacher it is not that easy. I do all by my self and have asked very few people but read alot without the possibility to ask questions. All I wanted was to ask questions and maybe get some help to reach Access Concentration.

When you realise that you are unable to do it (it seems impossible), like Brett said on 7 Meditations, look into your mind and sort out what is coming up.

It really is the whole point of it in the first place.

So what does come up when you sit down? Have a close look at it, when it is sorted out you will be closer to understanding your own question first.
Well, the thing is I did not understand what Brett ment, but I keep that in that forum.

You indeed hold the answer to why you find it impossible to be alone with yourself for 30 mins.
I can be alone for much longer than that but what I can't do is concentrate on one thing long enough to reach access concentration and the rest that follows with that.

Ok...
I do not have a internet connection in my home and need to go to a friend to write and read here so that's why my replies don't come so often, next time wont be until new year.

I will let you guys know something I have been "working" on for about a year and a half. I'm about to starting a new religon. I have been in "contact" with my "God" for about a year and a half now and I'm getting more and more in touch with the feelings I have about my God and how I need to live to live according to my God. My religon, which I rather call teaching, is pretty simular to buddhism with all of the rituals deleted. I do not want to teach anything until I have everything in place so I will leave it like that for now.

I can tell you the very first step you need to master in my teaching. The first thing I will teach people who want to follow my teaching is to reach Access Concentration. A step even I don't master. This religon therefor is for everyone, even I can't do the first step and have problems with it too. But followers of my teachings will be very mentally awake and free from all mindcontrol of corrupt governments, so I guess it will not be a hit in USA (I will be called terrorist by the US government even if Ron Paul wins because he will be assassinated), at least not in the beginning but eventually it will be everywhere. Total freedom from mental slavery!

Ron Paul is USA's hope but there are powers in the US that reach far beyond the president and those powers wont let a great man as Ron Paul be president, they want to keep the people enslaved and dumbed down so they/you can be more controllable and so that they can do what they want with your money. I would ofcourse want Ron Paul to win but for his own safety I hope the continue with the media blackout and that he can't win because it would be sad to see a another great man die by the hands of the new world order. Americans, you are in really deep shit, you now that right? You are like the modern version of the Indians you are treating like animals until this day, I've been there and seen it with my own heart, it did hurt! You are next...but do not believe me! Look it up for your self! They have allready robbed you of your money or you think that was an accident? You have been robbed! They have been able to do all this for years because of the mental state of the americans, you now the eat, consume and watch shit on TV mentality. That will not be interesting in my teaching because it is nothing that brings you to the next step insted it brings you the other way. There is nothing you can do, The NWO has your army in their backpocket and they are trained to kill you if you move out of place (look it up for yourself). They are right now taking your guns and make you even more harmless and they are slowly implementing Martial Law, I guess you have noticed that you are being raped in the airport, right? Do you think all of this is becuase of Obama Bin Laden oops, Usama Bin Laden, it's because of you. They have to much at stake and wont let Ron Paul save you, they need a puppet like Obama & CO.

Whoa! Hold my horses! Back to the topic!
With all the information I have now I will work towards my first step in 2012 and if I'm lucky I may be even on step 2 or 3 by this time next year, who knows. I will give it 2012 to reach this first step and about this time next year my religon/teaching will be officially born and I can start to teach the first step and no one wont get to step 2 until they master step 1. I really have now Idea how It's going to be, it's all up to my God who daily shows me where to put my feets, this is just my feelings and thoughts I get from walking the path my God has prepared for me.

My "God" is not a new God, it's a very easy "God" to accept and understand but I will let you know when the time comes.

Thanks for the help you've given me. I will do what I can with all I've learned.

I will read here again around new year.
Good luck with your own work!

mettajoey

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Re: Help with Access Concentration!
« Reply #10 on: December 20, 2011, 05:59:18 PM »
JS,
There is some truth in what you say and certainly plenty of youth.

Ecclesiastes 1:9

9 What has been will be again,
   what has been done will be done again;
   there is nothing new under the sun.

Good luck on your path.
The best type of meditation is the one that you'll do

Quardamon

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Re: Help with Access Concentration!
« Reply #11 on: December 20, 2011, 07:31:17 PM »
Hi Jhana Seeker,

Thank you for telling more.

I will let you guys know something I have been "working" on for about a year and a half. I'm about to start a new religion.
That sheds a bit more light on the reason you mentioned being in distress. In your first post, that was the main thing that struck me. I did not see why it should be painful for you, that you could not reach jhana. And you seemed to demand from yourself to reach that - like an athlete that had decided he wants to run a marathon in three and a half hours. (Most people do without marathons, and without jhanas, as you know.) ;)

In your first post here, you started with
I´ve a huge problem when meditating or trying to meditate. I´ve been trying for over 3 years on and off without ANY gains.
and you ended with
I´m in great need!        Thanks for reading this!

I suppose it would have been good if you had had a teacher, even earlier than now. It might be, that you are in a place now that is so dear to you, that you do not want to leave it. Some feelings and intuitions and convictions that we meet with in meditation are quite attractive.

   . . .   and I'm getting more and more in touch with the feelings I have about my God and how I need to live to live according to my God.
I suppose you like getting more in touch with these feelings. That is natural. And that is a tricky one.
I read a text from the European Middle Ages, when there was a living culture of meditating monks. The text is called "The Cloud of Unknowing". This monk teaches, that all the time that you try to know God, there is this cloud. A cloud between you and God. And every time you think you see God, it is the cloud that you see. Every time you have the feeling that you feel God, you tend to be happy with the feeling - but that is not God. So everything you consciously know, or feel or sense, is not God.
The modern translation that I read has an introduction that says that the text is quite like zen. To my knowledge, a Christian tradition of mystics that know these kind of meditations is not alive. In the nineteen-seventies and later, clergymen would turn to zazen to understand mysticism. (Mysticism in the sense of aiming at a direct experience of God.)

I suppose that I do not have the authority to give you a warning about the path you are on. But I will tell you about a warning that I was given once, by a man who tried to raise kundalini in me: 'Whenever it happens that you insist that you can tell right from wrong, whenever you think you can tell the Truth, whenever your friends can not support your opinion, then come back to the basic and daily things of life. And listen to your wife.'
When I met with him a month later, he had changed and said: 'We do not need kundalini. Christ has died for us. The work of redeeming has been done. We do not need to do it. We can simply accept that it has been done.' So he had stopped working with kundalini. Kundalini was not of his culture (and not of mine). He had stepped into the tradition where his roots were. He was far more quiet now.

You mention that you do not have a teacher. Do you have friends around you?
I suppose that you are an American working in Thailand, but is that so?

Oh - from your first post, you seem to want to know: I do not know if I ever was in jhana - I suppose so, but I do not know how to reproduce it. And with my cultural background, it does not have a religious value to me. From my background, being a caring father and husband have more value than religious rapture.

In short:
Leave it to God to be God
Leave it to the world to be the world
Train the art of being content to be just human.

   Sigh   -  I suppose  I am very content with myself now. It sounds so wise.   -   Sigh   -   I lost a minor job this morning. I suppose I want to compensate for that with using grand words here.    At any rate, the job that is financially important to me, I still have.

I hope this fits in somewhere with you.

Happy New Year!!!

Quardamon
« Last Edit: December 20, 2011, 07:34:00 PM by Quardamon »

Maysun

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Re: Help with Access Concentration!
« Reply #12 on: December 23, 2011, 04:23:19 PM »
To Jhana Seeker (quote function does not seem to work for me)

The whole story about your ´God´ and you teaching others ´your religion´ sounds creepy and somewhat sectaric to me. Either sectaric or psychotic, especially since you´re trying so hard to achieve something which is far off from buddhism.

I´m surprised by the encouraging responses you get, really.

Matthew

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Re: Help with Access Concentration!
« Reply #13 on: December 28, 2011, 01:48:51 PM »
....
Access Concentation is the only thing right now that I need to learn, I see that as the first step in meditation and everything before that is preperation for this 1st step.
....

You contradict yourself here. But that is not the important thing. Relaxed awake concentration is the first step in meditation. And dropping all your preconceived ideas about meditation .. and God .. and all the rest of it. It's about being able to sit silently and awake with your own being .. and just witnessing without interfering.

Happy New Year .. well .. it will be when you read this :)
~oOo~     Tat Tvam Asi     ~oOo~    How will you make the world a better place today?     ~oOo~    Fabricate Nothing     ~oOo~

Morning Dew

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Re: Help with Access Concentration!
« Reply #14 on: December 30, 2011, 08:52:42 AM »
Hi Jhana Seeker and welcome aboard of Vipassanaforum.

First of all Jhana is not being "seeked" but developed :) this is an important aspect which if understood will save much of you energy.
So changing your user name to Jhana Developer could be the first step ;) just joking ;)

In my experience on several occasions I'v experienced the 5th immaterial jhana, even before I started with buddhist meditation.
This showed me no Truth. Somehow i bypassed the first 4 Jhanas but dwelling in the 5th Jhana gave me no Insight.

I experienced the 1st Jhana but could not sustain it for long.
Jhanas cant be developed if the 5 Hindrances are present, this is the fat truth and one to take seriously if interested to walk the Jhanic Path.

Sensual desire (kamacchanda),
Ill-will (byapada),
Sloth and torpor (thina-middha),
Restlessness and remorse (uddhacca-kukkucca),
Sceptical doubt (vicikiccha).

All these must be understood, clearly comprehanded, calmed down and let go of before Jhana can develop.

I still have lots of issue with restlessness and sensual desire. Sometimes more and sometimes less.

My signature sais;
In one who is joyful (full of gladness), rapture/zest arises. In one who is rapturous, the body grows calm. One whose body is calmed experiences ease. In one at ease, the mind becomes concentrated - Mahanama Sutta.
Genuine Gladness & Goodwill will develop Jhana.

As you see Concentration is the fruit as well as Insight is. You can force concentration but in my experience that is Wrong Concentration. It is enough to be Mindful of body-mind arising and passing phenomena, Clearly Comprehanding them, Calming the formations with each breath and letting go of them. This is practiced again and again until it becoms a Total 24/7 Attention :)

I know it is possible to enter Jhanas through forced/volitionaly fabricated concentration but as such it is of no fruit/insight which leads to actual freedom.

Here is a good read on the 5 Hindrances. Be Aware of the, Comprehand them Clearly, Calm them down in the body or mind or both and let go of them by replacing them with wholesome Gladness and Goodwill. Jhana will develop.
http://www.accesstoinsight.org/lib/authors/nyanaponika/wheel026.html

May we all be happy



Morning Dew

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Re: Help with Access Concentration!
« Reply #15 on: December 30, 2011, 09:28:51 AM »
Just to add one more quote from the link above.

From the Samaññaphala Sutta   

I. The Sutta (Digha Nikaya No. 2)


Quote
And when he sees himself free of these five hindrances, joy arises; in him who is joyful, rapture arises; in him whose mind is enraptured, the body is stilled; the body being stilled, he feels happiness; and a happy mind finds concentration.

Then detached from sensual desires, detached from unwholesome states, he enters into and dwells in the first absorption (Jhana) which is accompanied by applied thought and reflection, born of detachment, and filled with joy and rapture. He enters into and dwells in the second... third... fourth absorption.

Jhana Seeker

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Re: Help with Access Concentration!
« Reply #16 on: December 31, 2011, 08:14:13 AM »
I suppose you like getting more in touch with these feelings. That is natural. And that is a tricky one.
I read a text from the European Middle Ages, when there was a living culture of meditating monks. The text is called "The Cloud of Unknowing". This monk teaches, that all the time that you try to know God, there is this cloud. A cloud between you and God. And every time you think you see God, it is the cloud that you see. Every time you have the feeling that you feel God, you tend to be happy with the feeling - but that is not God. So everything you consciously know, or feel or sense, is not God.
I guess that depends on your definition of ”God”. If you cant see or feel my God then you are blind deaf, and numb. I don´t want to go into this more because the thread will be huge. I will teach what I learn eventually when I have a better picture, it will be there for everyone who wants to be free from mental illness and slavery.

You mention that you do not have a teacher. Do you have friends around you?
I do have friends, buddhist friends but they do not know anything about meditation on that level, it is not common to reach access concentration even in a buddhist country like Thailand, all the rituals has blured the ”real” buddhism and that is something I do not want to be possible with my teachings. So I really appreciate to "talk" with you guys!

I suppose that you are an American working in Thailand, but is that so?
I´m a swedish guy training Muay Thai/Thaiboxing full time in Thailand

In short:
Leave it to God to be God
Leave it to the world to be the world
Train the art of being content to be just human.
I will help God in anyway I can
I will help the world in anyway I can
I believe this will make me a better human.

The whole story about your ´God´ and you teaching others ´your religion´ sounds creepy and somewhat sectaric to me. Either sectaric or psychotic, especially since you´re trying so hard to achieve something which is far off from buddhism.
You can label it how you want, but my teachings as a rather call it will be close to buddhism. How can you tell it will far from buddhism?
The basis will be meditation, with the goal of jhana, not only sitting and relaxing but training concentration, training the mind. Buddhism allready do this and I will use that. Teaching a undtrained mind is very hard and a waste of time. I will first teach people to use their minds before anything else. Not make them more stupid to be able to fool them more easy as the governments together with religons are doing to day. Bad, psychotic and sectaric right? Label me how you want, my goal is to free every mind that want to be freed, if you want to live in captivity under a faschist state be my guest, you can’t be freed anyway. But if you want to live free then I will do my best to free you.
I only want us to be free and will fight to the death to live free. Call it what you want!

....
Access Concentation is the only thing right now that I need to learn, I see that as the first step in meditation and everything before that is preperation for this 1st step.
....
You contradict yourself here. But that is not the important thing. Relaxed awake concentration is the first step in meditation. And dropping all your preconceived ideas about meditation .. and God .. and all the rest of it. It's about being able to sit silently and awake with your own being .. and just witnessing without interfering.
I correct my self, Access Concentration is the first stage, not the first step.
I see Access Concentration as the first stage of meditation, just as you recieve the first belt in a martial art. I don’t think you should go any further before mastering this stage. That’s how I see it.

In my experience on several occasions I'v experienced the 5th immaterial jhana, even before I started with buddhist meditation.
This showed me no Truth. Somehow i bypassed the first 4 Jhanas but dwelling in the 5th Jhana gave me no Insight.
I do not expect jhana to show me hidden truths but what I expect to be able to do with jhana is to use jhana as a instrument to think about things and be able to see them as they truly are. I have read that this is possible after you emerge from jhanas.

Jhanas cant be developed if the 5 Hindrances are present, this is the fat truth and one to take seriously if interested to walk the Jhanic Path.

Sensual desire (kamacchanda),
Ill-will (byapada),
Sloth and torpor (thina-middha),
Restlessness and remorse (uddhacca-kukkucca),
Sceptical doubt (vicikiccha).

All these must be understood, clearly comprehanded, calmed down and let go of before Jhana can develop.
To be honest I think this is the part I for some reason has be to sloppy with. I think the main reason for not putting in to much effort in this is because of a meditation book I bought where the author wrote 2 pages of why you had to get pass the first hindrance and only 2 rows of how to do it. It did not help me even a little bit and since then I have been hoping that I do not have any hindrances because of the lack of information on this, foolish of me but I guess there is a reason for me being for the lack of progress.

Here is a good read on the 5 Hindrances. Be Aware of the, Comprehand them Clearly, Calm them down in the body or mind or both and let go of them by replacing them with wholesome Gladness and Goodwill. Jhana will develop.
http://www.accesstoinsight.org/lib/authors/nyanaponika/wheel026.html
Tack så mycket! Jag ska läsa detta noga för jag tror det är här skon klämmer men av någon anledning inte velat ta itu med det och bara hoppats på att jag inte har så stora problem med dom att dom skulle vara ett hinder, som jag har lurat mig själv!

I hope you are from Sweden as the flag shows otherwise you wont understand much of the above.



Happy New Year to you all!

chintan

  • Maun
  • Member
    • Vipassana - Goenka
Re: Help with Access Concentration!
« Reply #17 on: December 31, 2011, 10:45:03 AM »
One of the things I love about Buddha and his teachings is no mention / reference to God.. this one word surely evokes such strong feelings in most of us.

Jhana seeker - you are very different from most of us here and we sure will learn a lot from you. You are welcome to join a skype session where we sit together to meditate.. One is planned for tomorrow and there is another thread where it is being discussed.. 

Happy new year folks..

Jhana Seeker

  • Guest
Re: Help with Access Concentration!
« Reply #18 on: January 01, 2012, 02:38:10 AM »
One of the things I love about Buddha and his teachings is no mention / reference to God.. this one word surely evokes such strong feelings in most of us.

That was one of the things that brought me to buddhism but then I couldn't fight the truth about the strong power that helps me everyday, the power of love, the power of God. I have always been a atheist until about 1 year and a half ago when I started to see that my life has been planned before I was even borne, that this world is on a schedule that we can´t do much about, just do what which is follow our hearts because that is how God guieds us, through our hearts.

I feel I need to "reveal" my God to make this a lot easier for ya'll to get the picture. It's really no secret...
My God that I feel is above all other religons/teachings is The Universe, my God is everything you see you can't go anywhere or do anything without God because God is everything. God brought me here and God sent some of you to help me on my Jhana Development. The thing that opened my atheist eyes was the help I was getting on the journey that I'm on, this couldn't be coincidences because it was happening everyday in so many ways, it had to be something with a consciousness far more superior than mine, I could only comprehend it as God, not as God as the world sees it today but God as in a power far more greater than any of us, the power of love. So my God is the nature, the universe, everything. Everything that you can imagine and everything you can't imagine is God. To me you can't escape God you can only fool your self. I'm pretty sure that there is a consciousness that is aware of everything you do even if you do it when nobody is around, the universe always know/feel/see you in more ways that you will ever know or understand because we are a so primitive part of the universe but we seem to think aboutus like the one and only creation, we are just a part of God and we all are part of Gods plan and the best thing we can do is to follow our hearts.

I'm all for peace and harmony but I daily train to be a great warrior to be able to protect my self against evil powers like hate which dominates the world today. I will never hit or kill someone that is not attacking me first but if I'm attacked I have God behind me and I will use everything in my power to brutaly paralyze everything that is attacking me in a way that sends a clear message to all the evil people in the world. Freedom to me is to do what you want AS long as you don't hurt anyone or anything but yourself, yes you can hurt yourself if you so want because it's you right to do so. So, do not put your hate on other people than yourself because soon there will be someone to brutaly punish you for it!

So there you have it...God, my God...The Universe, The Nature, Everything you can see, feel or touch and everything you can't see feel or touch. God is helping you all the time even if you do not think you need or want any help. God is the coolest thing I can imagine because everything I thing is cool, God created and I bet God has much more cool stuff to show me.

I do feel I need to explain that my God is not a God from any of the most common religons of today, which I always have seen as fairytales. Now we need the truth and I'm on a quest to find it and reveal it to everyone who also want it.

I thought I needed to explain this because it's a so big part of everthing I do and why I write here. The Universe, and you can't hide from it even if you try your hardest, so just embrace it and be one with it.

This is what I mean when I write the word "God". If you have any questions feel free to ask...

Jhana seeker - you are very different from most of us here and we sure will learn a lot from you. You are welcome to join a skype session where we sit together to meditate.. One is planned for tomorrow and there is another thread where it is being discussed..

That is very nice of you but my life is very complcated right now and I do not have a internet connection, I use internet at my friends house and I only stay here for the weekend and wont be coming back until next sunday when I have a day of from training. But when I have a internet connection at home I would like to join you!

This is all for now but I will come back here to read next sunday.

Thanks and may you all have a great year!

Morning Dew

  • Guest
Re: Help with Access Concentration!
« Reply #19 on: January 01, 2012, 08:00:42 AM »
Jhana Seeker, jag har flyttat till Svergie från Irland 6 år sedan. Tyvär är jag bara en svensk blatte LOL :D men jag hoppas at du är ingen Sverigedemokrat LOL :D
Please excuse my balck humor (svart humor på dansk) Im in a new years mood :)
 
Yes, i understand swedish very good but speak lesser good than i understand. I writte swedish but still make mistakes when writting sounds "O" or "U" (Å, Y, U, O or Ö) and when writting "E" (Ä or E). And of course Im still mixing the EN and ET. So much about my linguistical blatte pain LOL

@ the forum community;
Jhana Seeker asked clearly about Access Concentration and Jhana Development and questioning his belief is certainly not benefiting his path nor your path. It creates "conflict" and in conflict Jhanas do not develope. Gladness and Goodwill is needed to walk the Jhanic Path of The Buddha and to do so the 5 Hindrances must be calmed/let go of which will result in Gladness/Joyfulness, Calmness and Goodwill the prerequisite for Access Concentration and automaticaly Jhana.

Our dear Stefan is a God believer and no one questioned him for it nor should anyone do that. Our minds are the way they are, all we can do is look at them as thought in the Anapanasati Sutta and Satipatthana Sutta. We as a Sangha are to make people welcome so they feel at home. If you feel warm here as, I once did, you keep practicing with all of your heart.
But unwelcomed, questioned, ignored, thrown guidelines at (i guess im now talking about myself) is not what Sangha is for, im sure Buddha had diferent intend for a Sangha than this. Sangha is the personification of The Buddha through which he still in this very moment teaches his Dhamma.
The Buddha refrained about discussing God so shall we as his Sangha. Those who come into this home with their believes are to be let believe whatever they believe BUT all we are to do is make them feel welcome, warm, give them food and water, and help them with the very thing they ask for not raising agendas. Gladness and Goodwill at all times is the Path of Buddha. We are to remind one another of this all the time. This is what Sangha is for.

May we all be happy and free from hindrances

Jhana Seeker

  • Guest
Re: Help with Access Concentration!
« Reply #20 on: January 26, 2012, 05:54:31 AM »
This is a ”cleaner” version of the post in this thread I wrote in the morning of the 1st of januari when I was still drunk from new years eve and had slept very little. I do not feel good about writing so bad about something a respect so much so this is why I correct and edit the things I do not feel good about, I also added things that came up in my mind while writing. I always write from my heart so this does not change my view, only the way I wrote about it when my brain was a bit leathery from a long new years night.

One of the things I love about Buddha and his teachings is no mention / reference to God.. this one word surely evokes such strong feelings in most of us.

That was one of the things that brought me to buddhism but after some time I couldn't fight the truth about the strong power that helps me everyday, the power of love, the power of God. I have always been an atheist until about 1 year and a half ago when I started to see that my life has been planned before I was even born, that this world is on a schedule that we can’t do much about, insted just do the best that we can which is to follow our ”hearts” because that is how God guides us, through our ”hearts”.
I feel that I need to "reveal" my God to make it a lot easier for ya'll to understand what I’m talking about. It's really no secret...
My God that I feel is above all other religons/teachings is The Universe, my God is everything you see, and you can't go anywhere or do anything without God because God is everything. God brought me to Vipassana forum and God sent some of you to help me on my Jhana Development. The thing that opened my atheist eyes was the help I was getting on the journey that I'm on, this couldn't be coincidences because it was happening everyday in so many ways, some may call it the law of attraction, it had to be something with a consciousness/awareness far more superior than mine, I could only comprehend it as God, not as God as the world sees it today but God as in a awareness and consiousness far more greater than any of us. So my God is the nature, the universe, everything that you can imagine and everything you can't imagine is God. The way I see it, you can't escape God/the universe you can only fool yourself. I'm pretty sure that there is a consciousness that is aware of everything we do even if we do it when nobody is around, the universe always know/feel/see you in more ways that you will ever know or understand because we are a so primitive part of the universe but we seem to think about us like the one and only creation (some say that we are a mirror image of God, I don’t), we are just a part of God and we all are part of the creation and the best thing we can do is to follow our hearts.

I'm all for peace and harmony but I train daily to be a great warrior to be able to protect myself against evil powers like hate which dominates the world today. I will never hit or kill someone that is not attacking me first but if I'm attacked I have God behind me and I will use everything in my power to paralyze everything that is attacking me, in a way that sends a clear message to all the evil people in the world. Freedom to me is to do what you want as long as you do NOT hurt anyone but yourself, yes you can hurt yourself if you so want because it's your right to do so. But do not put your hate on other people than yourself because soon there will be someone to stop you for doing so!

So there you have it...God, my God...The Universe, The Nature, everything you can see, feel or touch and everything you can't see, feel or touch. God is helping you all the time even if you do not think you need or want any help. God is the coolest thing I can imagine because everything I think is cool God created and I bet God has much more cool stuff to show me.

I do feel I need to explain that my God is not a God from any of the most common religons of today, which I always have seen as fairytales (all based on the mystical ”force” that helps/guides us that I call consciousness/awareness of the universe). Now we need the truth and I'm on a quest to find it and then reveal it to everyone who also want it. I do believe that even the Buddha got help from ”my God”/the universe because he could otherwise go around looking his whole lifetime without finding anything of what he was looking for, but with the guidence of God/the universe he was able in a very short time experiance the things he needed and meet the people he needed to learn everything that he needed to eventually get enlightened. But I do not think of it as a God or Gods like in any other religon, only like a consciousness/awareness that is everywere and is helping us with all that we do, good or bad. If we want or do something bad then we attract something bad, if we want or do something good then we attract something good. This is the consciousness/awareness that brings us forward in the creation. My purpose in this life is written in my heart and by following my heart I live like I’m supposed to live and is guided by the universe and walk together with the creation. Today this world is run by evil people who are destroying this world and going against the creation to make money and to get more and more power/control, I believe that this will come with a price because they will never have the power to control the universe, the creation of the universe will win and they will pay for the choices they’ve made, they’ve got what they wanted but they don’t know the price for it yet. We can lie to people and we can even lie to ourselves but we can never lie to or cheat the universe.

I thought I needed to explain this because it's a so big part of everthing I do everyday and also why and what I write on Vipassana forum. The Universe, and you can't hide from it even if you try your hardest, I believe the best we can do is embrace the universe/God and be one with it.

This is what I mean when I write the word "God". If you have any questions feel free to ask...
So, ”my God” is really the Universe with the consciousness/awareness that helps and guides us. Did Buddha talk about this consciousness/awareness or did he only talk about the way that leads to nibbana, the ultimate truth? I know he did not want to let people get confused and therfore only tought things that would lead to nibbana. I have read alot but its hard to know what really comes as close as possible to the thoughts of the Buddha himself and what comes from a bad translation from another bad translation of what someone heard another person say that the Buddha said. It would indeed be very interesting to talk to the Buddha himself!

I would like to write something for all you who may be sad or even depressed or know someone who is sad or depressed:
Since I started to ”follow my heart” I have gone from being the person this brainwashed society tried to turn me in to with a ”heart” that had to be shut off, to being the person I was supposed to be . All you who is depressed and don’t see any purpose in life, I think that maybe you do not follow your heart and you do not live as ”yourself”, you live like other people want you to live and this breaks your heart, you need to live free, your heart needs to be free. You can take all the medication you like but you will never be truly well until your heart is free. This may sound easy but is not, it’s a lot of hard work and it may be a long way back but it is the true way back to yourself. Do not do what other people tell you to do or want you to do, do only what your heart tells you to do, without hurting anyone. Some people may get sad by the choices you make but you will be able to repair all that when you feel better and stronger.

Trust me when I say that I have been very depressed myself and during this time I was 100% sure that I was without a doubt the worst person in the history of mankind, more bad than any other. I punished myself mentally very hard and what I did at ”the bottom of my hell” was to listen to my heart, and then follow it and it has led me back to me and now I want to see what I can do from here. The foundation is now all set and now I’m going to see what it is that is going to stand on this huge foundation that has taken me almost 12 years to build. I do not longer see myself as the most evil person in the history of mankind but I good person who is trying to do the right thing. Follow your heart, always! It will guide you...
This is the best advice I can give: Be true to yourself, follow your heart and never give up! The Universe will give you all the help you need. Be patient and move slowly forward, like a growing tree!

My way is a little bit different from Buddha’s as he thought that everything is suffering/dukkha and he found a way to stop being reborn by realizing nibbana and by doing so never experience suffering again. Well, if you want that kind of happiness then his way is here for you already. I believe that suffering will make me stronger and appriciate the good things in life more and I do not feel I have to stop being reborn, I do not see why I would not like to experience life again even though I’ve lived the most part in a cold and heartless hell and I’ve not even gotten out from it yet but I have seen the beauty of the world and the beauty of love so I’m not scared of ”hell”. I’m also not scared of not being reborn again, if the possibility is there I sure would like to be reborn and have a new life experience, why not, because it hurts, because it’s dukkha? If buddhism wasn’t here today then maybe I would have looked for the same things that the Buddha did but he already discovered these things and I’m now looking for another way to happiness, I do not want to live as a monk for the rest of my life, I want to live a life with dukkha and still be happy and I want to create a world that is worth being reborn into and live another life with pleasure and pain and not stop ”me” from being reborn. To me that is called life, life is hard and life is good, if life only was good it would be very boring and pointless. I believe that I’m a warrior and I need the struggle, I need the fight to make me feel alive. I guess what I’m searching for is the warriors way, I believe there is a warrior in all of us and my way of life will make us powerfull warriors, warriors with great love and respect. I do not believe the Buddha was wrong in any way, but I do believe that we can be happy without relinquish almost everything, become a begger and stopping us from being reborn to end the suffering. I’m not scared of the suffering, insted I want to live with it to appreciate life in a greater way. God/The Universe has created a far to beautiful world to stop being reborn into, insted I will find a way to make us strong and live happy lives with all the suffering it brings with it. BUT to be honest, one of the biggest things that keep me from living the life of a monk is the women, if I can’t have women then that is not a way for me! Maybe, when I’m 80-100 years old, MAYBE then I would spend the rest of my days in a temple. No women, yo’ comon’ man, what do you ask from me? To me that is a bit insane becasue if all the people lived like that all the humans would die out, that way is not for all of us. I believe we can do everything in a way that is healthy, we do not need to completely relinquish everything exept the robe and alms bowl to live a pure life. My way would be possible for all people to live at the same time in eternity or at least as long as the Universe allow it. I do not mean that everyone have to live that way but the point is that it has to be a way that allows us all to live the same way if we so would like.

Buddha’s way – the monks way, to live by it to the fullest you need to be a monk and realize nibbana and end the suffering forever by never being reborn again.
My way – the warriors way, to live by it to the fullest you need to bring out the warrior in you and fight through the pain and suffering.
You will become a warrior who fight all the bad things that comes in your way, may it be obsticales, everyday problems or another warrior who want to match his/her skills against yours in the cage/ring, whatever it is, a true warrior fight til’ the end. I will fight in the cage but that’s because I have the need for it, most of do not.
Buddha and his followers are not physically strong people, my way will make you BOTH mentally and physically strong to make you the best person you possible can be for as many years as possible, I weak body breaks down and dies more quickly.
Don’t get me wrong I do respect the Buddha’s way very much and I think that it is a better teaching than any other out there right now but it does not satisfy my warrior heart just as the young soon to be Buddha’s warrior skills did not satisfy his yearning for the holy life. I want to create a way where we can have the best of both, a new middle way. I respect those who choose to become monks but right now that is not for me. Who knows, maybe I will end my days in a temple being fully enlightened and realizing nibbana, but until then I will live like a warrior and enjoy all the things God has created for us, in a good and healthy way.

I have a huge vision but I will test it on myself before I teach it to other people. As soon as I can I will teach people how to follow their hearts, get physically and mentally strong and how to catch their dreams but for now the only thing I can do is to write my thoughts. I’m in the middle of doing all of it to myself so if I start to teach then it’s fom first-hand experiance. It has been a long and hard road but I will never give up. I believe that meditation is a good way to start but I do not know how to meditate properly so I can not say more about that, yet. I still have so much to learn and that is why I don’t want to or can not teach anything right now, I can just tell people what has made me feel better from all the years in the cold ”hell/evil/hate” I’ve spent 90% of my life in. I have always been able to see/feel small parts of ”heaven/good/love” and from those parts I’ve felt hope and be able to fight on. If you ask me we have both heaven/good/love and hell/evil/hate here on earth and right now hell is bigger and is growing larger everyday on the expence of heaven. It is of course more complicated than that but basicaly this is how I see it, we have the choice to make between good and bad and you have to choose what you think is right for you, but if you do not make a choice then bad gets your ”vote”. If you don’t actively speak out against something you do not like, then you are automaticaly for it”

I always try to be as simple as possible when I write my thoughts because I want it to be as easy as possible to understand for everyone who reads it. Sometimes when I read books on buddhism it’s like I need to learn a whole new language to understand what they are writing, does it have to be so hard to explain something or is buddhism so complicated or does things get so advanced that even I will have to start use that kind of ”language” when I try to explain my thoughts later on as I learn more and more? I read alot of english books on diet, training, stretching, meditation, you name it and I can read it with out any problems to understand but when it comes to buddhism it becomes so strange sometimes, like they are really not talking about anything at all and only try to sound wise with complicated words. I do not blame the buddha for this of course! It’s my english that is not that advanced, but does it have to be so complicated and weird? I try to keep my words on a level that is easy to understand for all people, especially those with ”normal” english, you know the kind of english you talk with avarage people and not with professors. I may fail to explain myself but I always try to get better because I feel I have a lot to say, good things in a world full of confusion and lies and I want to teach people how to eat healthy, exersice right, meditate on high levels and to live a peaceful life in one with The Universe, you know common things, at least it should be common things and if I have something to say about it, then it will be common and basic knowledge.

Do not take my words for anything else than words from someone who write their thoughts on internet message boards! I write this just as much for myself as for anyone else, maybe even more for myself right now, to get things off my ”chest”. I will stop here because I can go on forever but this is getting so long, too long...

Peace

Jhana Seeker

  • Guest
Re: Help with Access Concentration!
« Reply #21 on: January 26, 2012, 05:56:23 AM »
I just wanted to thank you all for the help I’ve recieved on Vipassana forum. They biggest help was a PM I got about Vipassana retreats and after that I have been looking and searching for a retreat to go to and learn how to meditate properly. I’m now in the final stages before going to a retreat and at this place I’m able to stay for how long as I want and not only 10 days as the most places. I will stay at a buddhist temple in Thailand and will basicaly do the same things as all the monks do but I will have fewer rules to follow and I will have a white shirt and white pants insted of a yellow robe. I will here train both samatha and vipassana meditation as good as I can and calm my mind as much as I can. I will do my best to calm my mind everyday as well as training my concentration, insight and mindfullness. This is something huge I have infront of me, without a doubt a milestone in my life! I great start on this new year!

This is a perfect exampel of how God helps me! I’m sorry that I can’t write the name of the person who sent the PM because maybe there is a reason for sending a private message and not writing in this thread so you just have to believe me for now. But I came to this forum and got help to do something I would not do by myself because I did not know about the possibility even though it was so close to me and free of charge on top of that. It did not happen exactly as I was suggested to do but I got the push in the back that I needed to make this happen. This was the only thing I was missing in my life and training but has now have some major changes to the better and all thanks to the guidence of The Universe, I reached out and this is the help that I got. You can call it coincidence but if so then my life is full of these coincidenceses all the time.

So, this is the last I write until I get back from the retreat and hopefully has been able to reach jhana but that is not the goal with the retreat, my goal is to calm my mind down to a very subtle and pure mind. I will keep a journal of my progress and I will be back and tell you how it went, especially you who sent the PM!
Thank you all very much!

Peace!

Matthew

  • The Irreverent Buddhist
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  • Meditation: It's a D.I.Y. project.
    • KISS: Keep it simple stupid.
    • Getting nowhere slowly and enjoying every moment.
Re: Help with Access Concentration!
« Reply #22 on: January 26, 2012, 09:59:43 AM »
Be well - sounds like a good way forward for you.

Matthew
~oOo~     Tat Tvam Asi     ~oOo~    How will you make the world a better place today?     ~oOo~    Fabricate Nothing     ~oOo~

Sylvia1982

  • Member
  • Write something about yourself here
    • goenka jee
Re: Help with Access Concentration!
« Reply #23 on: February 27, 2012, 12:25:09 PM »
It took me 7 Goenka retreats, 1 IMC retreats and two hours of meditation daily for five hours  just to be able to feel the senations on upper part of the lip as concentration excercise. Although, I don't have access concentration but the desire to access concentration could be the very hindarnce for you.

Thanks

rob

  • Guest
Re: Help with Access Concentration!
« Reply #24 on: February 27, 2012, 06:02:12 PM »
My takeaway is pure ego.