Author Topic: Why we lost our baby?  (Read 5439 times)

alexaquatic

Why we lost our baby?
« on: April 09, 2011, 04:36:57 PM »
Hi

I haven't written here in a long time. I have kept my meditation practice and I think I have been doing better. Right now I am going through a huge pain.

My wife was pregnant of our first baby and due to physical conditions (the bag broke way before it should), we lost him in the fifth month. I just want to ask the simple question: why? We and the doctors did everything we could but we couldnt stop it. We are good people and I am sure we will be excellent parents some day. But we keep asking ourselves, why? why us? We have this huge pain inside right now. Is there a right answer from the spiritual point of view?Could we have done something more to save him? Prayers? Meditation?

Thanks for your answer....

Alejandro

ivana

Re: Why we lost our baby?
« Reply #1 on: April 09, 2011, 06:36:46 PM »
Dear Alejandro
I believe you did as much as you could do.  I think there is  nothing as painful as losing a child. My heart aches for you.
Ivana

Morning Dew

Re: Why we lost our baby?
« Reply #2 on: April 09, 2011, 08:40:32 PM »
Alejandro my friend i feel your pain. I am sorry for the baby, your wife and you.

I was there a few times in the last 3 years. We lost the fetus 3 times. I held my wife while she was sitting on the toilet bleeding the fetus out, while crying her soul out.
I felt like shoit not able to make it better, not able to do anything but hold her.

We lost the fetus each time at week 9. After this we cant even get pregnant anymore but we are still trying. This not even close to your pain of loosing a child in the 5th month.

You ask what to do. Well this is what i did after the first miscarriage;

I started to learn crystal healing And i got attuned to Reiki to heal my wife. I even got attuned to Archangel Michael to heal her even better.
I Even prayed and yet we got 2 more miscarriages. We were heartbroken.
We tried a new but to this day we can not stay pregnant.
I too asked my self Why We?

Any way my wife had huge expectation from the reiki healing and got even more disapointed when miscarriages hapened again.
I dropped all the Reiki and crystals and found Shamatha on this forum. I practice it daily for more than a year now and my wife meditates occasionally.   Since then we are actualy able to talk about it since after the 3rd miscarriage we stopped mentioning babys.

I will advise you to practice Shamatha. Prayers didnt work for me nor did reiki, crystals nor accupuncture. It is easy to go into dispair after such a great loss and from there things can go downhills for a couple.
To be able to be there for yourself and for your wife please keep sitting to keep the sanity. And in shamatha you and your wife will be able to grieve naturaly without falling in dispair.

Your wife will feel lots of guilt. She will feel that it was her fault for dropping the child. In her mind she was the one who failed.
Tell her many times it is nobodies fault and give a hug as much as you can.

Be well.

Che

Quardamon

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    • Teachers were: P.K.K. Mettavihari, Frits Koster, Nel Kliphuis. (In the line of Mahasi Sayadaw)
Re: Why we lost our baby?
« Reply #3 on: April 09, 2011, 09:53:21 PM »
Hello Alejandro,

We did not meet yet. I am on this forum a bit shorter than you.
I am sorry to hear about your enormous pain and that of your wife.
@ Che: Also for you and your wife. I knew most of it already. It still is a painful thing, even if handling the pain goes better.
For me it seems a long time ago, that my wife-of-that-time and I lost a child after 20 weeks of pregnancy. For three months we cried a lot, and then we came over it. That was quite fast. It was a very different situation from the situation of each of you.

Alejandro, it is natural to cry out: "Why?! Why us?!". Just as it is natural to be angry at some point - angry with God, maybe.
In my honest opinion, there is there is no answer to the question - not a logical answer.
There certainly is life in the question. If you would simply drop the question because there is no logical answer, it might cost you some life force.   . . .   Well, maybe I should just say: I honour your despair, if it is that. At any rate, I honour your pain.

I wish you blessings, for your wife and you.
(That is not the parlance of a vipassanaut, but still I do.)

Quardamon

Matthew

  • The Irreverent Buddhist
  • Member
  • Meditation: It's a D.I.Y. project.
    • KISS: Keep it simple stupid.
    • Getting nowhere slowly and enjoying every moment.
Re: Why we lost our baby?
« Reply #4 on: April 09, 2011, 10:48:46 PM »
Alejandro,

The answer is that these things happen sometimes. It is not your fault and you could not have done more. It is perhaps one of the greatest trauma's to lose a child, yet one you have not held. Cry as much as you need to and also remember it is not your fault. And this too shall pass my friend, deep as the grief is.

Warmly,

Matthew
~oOo~     Tat Tvam Asi     ~oOo~    How will you make the world a better place today?     ~oOo~    Fabricate Nothing     ~oOo~

Andrew

  • Member
    • friends tell me things, sometimes I listen.
    • Letting Go.
Re: Why we lost our baby?
« Reply #5 on: April 10, 2011, 02:43:27 AM »
Hi Alejandro,

Good to met you, though the circumstances leave something to be desired..

I have been there as well, lost a girl at 6 months in the womb. In Oz that is legally viable so there is a birth certificate and we had a funeral. If you haven't done it already, having a ceremony to honour the baby is important. Name it  also. Was it a boy or a girl?

We had a little girl, we called her Shekinah, which is jewish for 'manifest presence of god'. 

I have long maintained that there was things that we could have done better, but then 3 years ago my wife's sister had the same thing happen at 6 months. So what does that mean? It moved quickly beyond my comprehension 'Why'.

Our miscarriage was 12 years ago now. My oldest son is now eleven. My wife was very determined to give birth before the anniversary of Shekinah's death, and it happened. Just recently, on my wife's birthday this year, her sister gave birth to a baby girl. They named he Savannah.  They didn't realise the similarities in the name, and the baby was 6 weeks premature, though perfectly OK.  Needless to say, neither of us can remember what I got here for her birthday!

I won't sum up with anything profound, as I didn't have anything then, and I still don't. I hope you have lots of children and they all know that there was another. All 3 of my sons know about Shekinah, and my oldest son knows that he wasn't the first.

love

andy

Edit: I just re-read your post and saw it was a boy.
« Last Edit: April 10, 2011, 02:59:30 AM by andy »
getting it done

alexaquatic

Re: Why we lost our baby?
« Reply #6 on: April 10, 2011, 03:55:18 AM »
I am deeply grateful of your answers. They give me peace and some perspective of what's happening to us. I'll get back to you with my thougths as soon as I can.

Mungo

  • Member
    • Shamatha
    • Smiling Politely
Re: Why we lost our baby?
« Reply #7 on: April 11, 2011, 04:24:43 AM »
Like everyone else here I am very sorry to read about your loss.

----------

I just want to ask the simple question: why?

It is a simple question isn't it but unfortunately is one that, if it can be answered once, only leads to the same question again, and again, and again.........
I don't think the human mind is capable of reaching an understanding of such infinite regress and seems to lead to more suffering.


We and the doctors did everything we could but we couldnt stop it. We are good people and I am sure we will be excellent parents some day.

Which is why you shouldn't be burdened by the guilt of a non existent "crime".

Could we have done something more to save him?

Even if you or anyone could answer this, would it be helpful, now in the present.

With the risk of sounding patronizing - wisdom compassion and equanimity.

And don't end up like this guy - http://records.viu.ca/~Johnstoi/Kafka/beforethelaw.htm

You can't wake a person who is pretending to be asleep

Vivek

  • Moderator
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    • Advaita & U Ba Khin's tradition
Re: Why we lost our baby?
« Reply #8 on: April 11, 2011, 07:06:48 AM »
Deeply sorry to hear about your loss, Alejandro. While I am still not able to fully comprehend the pain (as I am not even married yet) related to the loss of a child, the intensity with which you ask "why?" leaves no doubt about it in my mind. As others have already pointed out, there is simply no answer to that question. Some things are just bound to happen, sometimes, again and again. All we can do is to gather the pieces and continue with the journey, hoping that if it happens next time, at least we would be able to deal with it a little better than we did before. It is said that every experience is here to bless you, to teach you, and not to hurt you. I hope you will gather your strength in time and would be able to move on. I wish you all the very best.   
Let's go beyond this illusion, shall we?

Jeeprs

Re: Why we lost our baby?
« Reply #9 on: April 11, 2011, 09:27:45 AM »
I am sorry for your loss also. But as regards the 'Why?', I gently urge you to put aside that question. There are many answers one could speculate about, medical, or even spiritual. But some things just need to be accepted. This doesn't mean being cold or uncaring. One can feel deeply, without, however, requiring an explanation.
« Last Edit: April 11, 2011, 09:32:08 AM by Jeeprs »

Daiho

Re: Why we lost our baby?
« Reply #10 on: April 12, 2011, 08:56:30 AM »
When I first read your post a couple of days ago, I didn't quite know what to say except "I'm sorry."  Maybe that's enough.

Thinking about you later made me pull a book off the shelf and read through it again.  I found something that I hope might be helpful.  If so, maybe you'd like to check out the book in its entirety.  It contains quite a bit of wisdom, from someone who has worked with death and dying for thirty years.

All my best wishes to you and your wife.

Quote
…become aware of the stories around death – the stories we are telling ourselves, the stories our culture tells us, the stories that our health-care institutions have created.  Please direct awareness toward what you might tell yourself about dying and death.  Become familiar with how you might shield yourself from the truth of death with certain ideas or how you can let the story be a raft taking you to the other shore.

Learn to access that still inner space where wisdom rests, the wisdom that allows us to question, see, and learn from everything within and around us.  This wisdom embraces the story, can inform the story, and is not the story.

As one woman was dying, she expressed relief that everyone around her was so very calm.  The wild search for a cure for her cancer had taken her to many extremes as she clung to her story that she would die of old age.  She still felt the momentum of the search as she approached active dying.  Then, one day, she seemed to stop.  Her busyness simply came to an end.  Those of us sitting with her felt the shift as she joined us like an island sailing into a stable continent.  She finally settled down to die, with a narrative of acceptance supporting her journey toward the unknown.  This woman’s new story gave her the strength to let go.

Our practice of not-knowing points to an openness in perspective, an openness that is deeper than a story, deeper than our expectations, deeper than our wishes, deeper than our personality, deeper than the cultural constructs.  Being with dying gives us a precious opportunity to question all our stories, to drop the old harmful fabrications that no longer serve, and to transform our stories into healing fictions that help us show up for our living and dying.

Joan Halifax
Being with Dying, 2008
Ch 7:  Fictions that Hinder and Heal:  Facing Truth and Finding Meaning



joy

  • Member
Re: Why we lost our baby?
« Reply #11 on: April 13, 2011, 05:42:13 AM »
Dear mate,

I know what is going on inside you as a helpless father.
Please gather yourself and this is the time I know that your beloved wife want you much more.
Open your Heart and give her lots of love.
My story:
I lost my first daughter at the age of 5 months. They said it was Down’s syndrome. Next one year we moved clinic to clinic covering almost one forth of India to carry out many tests. Afterwards I am blessed with a beautiful daughter, now reading at class X. She is brilliant in study, drawings, etc; we are very proud of her.
Only thing that made us moving was faith & love amongst us.   

Here I quote a famous Dhammapada story below:
Cure for Gisa Kotami dead Son
     Soon after Gisa Kotami got married, she gave birth to a son whom she loved dearly. Then, one day, when he was just beginning to learn how to walk, he suddenly fell ill and died. This left Gisa Kotami deeply grieved.
Unable to accept her only son’s death, she roamed the streets with him held tightly in her arms, asking whomever she came across for some medicine that could cure her son and bring him back to life.
Luckily she came upon a kindly man who realized her plight and advised her to go and see the Buddha. “The Buddha alone,” he told her, “has the antidote to death.”

When the Buddha saw Gisa Kotami, he realized that she was too grief-stricken to listen to reason and so resorted to some skillful means to help her. He told her that he could indeed restore her son back to life if she could get him a mustard seed.
 “However,” the Buddha warned, “the mustard seed must not come from any household where death has ever occurred. If you can bring one back to me, your child will live again.”
Gisa Kotami felt great relief and was overjoyed at the prospect of having her son once more playing at her side. Full of hope, she hurriedly went from house to house, but nowhere could she find a household in which no one had ever died. At last it dawned on her that she was not alone in her grief, for everyone else had suffered the loss of a loved one at one time or another.
When she realized that, she lost all attachment to the dead body of her son and understood what the Buddha was trying to teach her: nothing born can
ever escape death. Gisa Kotami then buried her son and went to tell the Buddha that she could find no family where tears had never been shed over a lost loved one.
The Buddha said to her, “You have now seen that it is not only you who have ever lost a son, Gisa Kotami. Death comes to all beings, for fleeting and impermanent is the nature of all component things.”
Gisa Kotami then became a nun and strove hard to eventually perceive the state of no death and no sorrow, which is the deathless state of Nibbana.
Better it is to live one day comprehending the Deathless than a hundred years without ever comprehending the Deathless.
« Last Edit: April 13, 2011, 05:45:36 AM by joydeep »
Joy

Stefan

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Re: Why we lost our baby?
« Reply #12 on: April 16, 2011, 10:40:53 AM »

why?


I cry with you. There is no "why", there's just things happening, and there's us dealing with it. Friends of mine lost their baby in the 8th months ... they did everything they could, they meditate, they do yoga ect. they lead a good life. Still it happened. They cried, and I too, but they tried not to cling to a question like "why". They needed all their power to accept it as it is. They said they are happy for the wonderful eight months, and that makes me cry again. But it took away the bitterness.

Metta to you, Stefan
« Last Edit: April 16, 2011, 10:43:36 AM by stefan »
anicca

alexaquatic

Re: Why we lost our baby?
« Reply #13 on: April 24, 2011, 07:38:03 PM »

Thanks again for each of your answers. Your wisdom has helped me understand this situation better.

A couple of weeks have passed now and we've been feeling better. I stopped asking why and just accepted as something that just happened. I've had some much work that I've hardly had time to think about it too much, but the most important thing is that I understand that one has to just move on and learn something from the experience. The good news is that my wife is in good health and we can try again in 3 or 4 months, as the doctors said, and we really want to try again.

My wife obviously has taken it a little harder than me, mostly because her faith in something greater than us has been shaken. We both were raised catholic, but like 4 years ago, we stopped going to church because it wasn't fulfilling and we didn't agree anymore with some of their teachings. She still believed in God and I started to have doubts about his existence. Then I discovered meditation and buddhism and it has been working great for me. She, in the other hand started getting more into metaphysics, but right now she doesn't know in what to believe anymore and I don't blame her. I've tried to get her interested in meditation, but so far she has not been really  interested. It’s difficult to stop believing in something (God) that you believed in your whole life, and something that most of your friends and family believe.

Anyway, thanks for reading and again thanks for your kind words.

Alejandro

Matthew

  • The Irreverent Buddhist
  • Member
  • Meditation: It's a D.I.Y. project.
    • KISS: Keep it simple stupid.
    • Getting nowhere slowly and enjoying every moment.
Re: Why we lost our baby?
« Reply #14 on: April 24, 2011, 10:14:12 PM »
Alejandro,

I'm glad to hear you are feeling more balanced towards your loss and this experience. Keep with it with the meditation and be sure not to let work pressures lead to you suppressing emotions if they are there.

Your wife does not need to give up any of her beliefs to benefit from meditation. In meditation she can investigate them, as well as gaining the other benefits we know of.

Warm regards and be well,

Matthew
~oOo~     Tat Tvam Asi     ~oOo~    How will you make the world a better place today?     ~oOo~    Fabricate Nothing     ~oOo~

alexaquatic

Re: Why we lost our baby?
« Reply #15 on: April 24, 2011, 10:19:25 PM »
Alejandro,

I'm glad to hear you are feeling more balanced towards your loss and this experience. Keep with it with the meditation and be sure not to let work pressures lead to you suppressing emotions if they are there.

Your wife does not need to give up any of her beliefs to benefit from meditation. In meditation she can investigate them, as well as gaining the other benefits we know of.

Warm regards and be well,

Matthew

Thanks Matthew. I am defintely trying to balance my work, my family life and my meditation time, but as I am sure you all know, sometimes is hard.

About my wife, you're right, I'll try to get her into the books I've been reading and let her find her way...

Stefan

  • The Marvellous Omannobazong!!!
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  • love is the key
    • Vipassana (Goenka), Freestyle, Family, God
Re: Why we lost our baby?
« Reply #16 on: June 17, 2011, 07:49:25 AM »

About my wife, you're right, I'll try to get her into the books I've been reading and let her find her way...


That's right! Just parroting Matthew: she doesn't need to change a thing.
I'm a "god-believer", too. This never interefered with my practice.
On the contrary: the practice of Vipassana changes believe to understanding.

Metta, Stefan
anicca

 

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