Author Topic: Meditation is causing insomnia for me - why?  (Read 53484 times)

Morning Dew

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Re: Meditation is causing insomnia for me - why?
« Reply #25 on: January 31, 2011, 08:02:05 PM »
Thank you Matthew for yet another great advice  :)

On top of what TIB said I would just add my personal experience which works well for me and that is to sleep on the oposite side of the bed. So I simply put my head where my feet were and I fall a sleep in a few minutes.
Another good way for me is to use ear pluggs. This way I just hear my self breathing and ... sound sleep in a few minutes.

Che

DANE01

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Re: Meditation is causing insomnia for me - why?
« Reply #26 on: January 31, 2011, 08:38:00 PM »
>>>IRR. BUDDHIST

Thanks for a great and highly detailed reply. I think I will try and implement what you suggested: Stick to my meditation practice as it is, don't try and find up ways to hide myself from emotions and also maybe make a list, as you point out.

I know I have to continue meditation, even though it is hard. I am so close to being almost cured of social anxiety (80% gone within a month), and I have the feeling that all I need is just a little courage to see these hard times through, until I learn to cope with the meditation in a proper way.


Jhana4

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Re: Meditation is causing insomnia for me - why?
« Reply #27 on: February 01, 2011, 09:13:16 PM »
Hi there

Hope someone can help me.

Ive been doing meditation for a month now. I focus on the breath through the nose.

Its given me incredible benefits, but it is also making me unable to sleep. For the past 20 days i've had great difficulty falling asleep. Could this be because im entering some sort of meditative state when i go to bed?

Hope you can help. I dont want to give up meditation.

Greetings from Denmark, by the way


I apologize if this ground has already been covered,   I don't have time to read all of the other replies.

I had this same problem many years ago and got over it.

First, meditate earlier in the day, further away from bed time.

Second, slight differences in attitude during meditation produce huge differences in the results.   Concentration in Theravada meditation is achieved by LETTING GO of distractions,  NOT by PUSHING or PULLING yourself back to the object.

You should do meditation with the attitude that it is a relaxation exercise.   In fact once you get warmed up, it might help to silently repeat "relax" on every out breath for a while AND practice "letting go" by letting go of the tension in your muscles as much you can, as well asletting go of anything on your mind.

You also may not be strong enough or flexible enough to sustain the posture you are using.  That could be generating muscular tension which could be leading to adrenaline being dumped into your system.   Get stronger.   Get more flexible.   In the interim, change you posture more often or meditate only as long as you are completely comfortable.

Above all, meditate with the attitude of relaxing, letting go.......not with an attitude of trying to make something happen.



Matthew

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Re: Meditation is causing insomnia for me - why?
« Reply #28 on: February 02, 2011, 12:17:56 AM »
...I apologize if this ground has already been covered,   I don't have time to read all of the other replies. ....


Welcome to the forum Jhana4. This place is very much about community. I'd suggest reading things to the extent you can before posting.

In the Dhamma,

Matthew
~oOo~     Tat Tvam Asi     ~oOo~    How will you make the world a better place today?     ~oOo~    Fabricate Nothing     ~oOo~

DANE01

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Re: Meditation is causing insomnia for me - why?
« Reply #29 on: February 02, 2011, 05:33:32 PM »
>>>JHANA4

Thanks a lot for your answer. I think I may be too bad at relaxing during meditation (mentally) and too much focused on doing it "the right way".. I think I will start to take some time to become relaxed first, before meditating.

My experience is quite weird: I average only 4-5 hours of sleep every night, and my fingers are starting to feel slightly stiff - typing is kinda hard :). And I also feel dizzy during the day, and have trouble concentrating when at work. Bottom line - I am not getting enough sleep. Yet I feel so "awake" in a funny way during the day and at night. It's like when I lie down to sleep, I feel so alert, I can sense everything that is going with my body and breath, and the last thing I feel the need for, is to sleep.

How did you overcome this problem? And how long did it take you?..

Thanks for your input

Dane

Matthew

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Re: Meditation is causing insomnia for me - why?
« Reply #30 on: February 02, 2011, 05:55:13 PM »
Dane,

Jhana4 explains how in his post if you read it again.

What you are describing seems like a state of hyper-awareness or alertness, probably related to some past trauma in your life. Relax into the meditation and have no fear. Try sticking to some of the suggestions made earlier for a while and see how they work out. It takes time for new things to sink in.

Warmly,

Matthew
« Last Edit: February 02, 2011, 05:57:32 PM by The Irreverent Buddhist »
~oOo~     Tat Tvam Asi     ~oOo~    How will you make the world a better place today?     ~oOo~    Fabricate Nothing     ~oOo~

Matthew

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Re: Meditation is causing insomnia for me - why?
« Reply #31 on: February 03, 2011, 07:40:02 AM »
Cognitive Neuroscience of Mindfulness Meditation

About 29 minutes in he is talking about the Amygdala and an immediate response in new meditators such that before better regulation cuts in the mindfulneess leads to a burst in Amygdala reactivity. Amygdala is behind anxiety symptoms. Keep going and the spike drops.
~oOo~     Tat Tvam Asi     ~oOo~    How will you make the world a better place today?     ~oOo~    Fabricate Nothing     ~oOo~

Andrew

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Re: Meditation is causing insomnia for me - why?
« Reply #32 on: February 03, 2011, 08:46:59 AM »
Hi Dane,

Some practical questions.

Are you being safe?? (Being so tired, are you putting your life at risk driving to work etc?) Have you been prescribe medications that you are not taking? 

Not to say what is being said isn't relevant, but we do need to be careful as we are dispensing advice to you about something which could be dangerous (driving while tired is like driving while drunk) Whatever the cause, I am concerned that you are safe and mentally able to deal with what you are going through. You mention "Anxiety", has this been professionally diagnosed? If so, you need to make sure you are communicating with your doctor and keeping them in the loop with all of this. Do what you can, and use modern medicine for what it's worth. There is no prize if your tiredness leads to an injury or worse. (I'm not trying to add to your anxiety by the way, I just know that we are talking across cyberspace, I would feel lots better to know that your doctor is attending to you in person)

love

Andy
getting it done

Quardamon

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Re: Meditation is causing insomnia for me - why?
« Reply #33 on: February 03, 2011, 12:53:47 PM »
Hello DANE01,

Pfff. You seem to be in an unpleasant situation. And you seem to have been so for quite some time.

How would it be if we saw it like this:
Over the last years, there has been in your life something hidden. This Factor X had the form of an anxiety. It was known, unpleasant and most of the time present, as an anxiety.
Recently, half december 2010, you started meditation. That changed the form of the X Factor. In stead of anxiety you now had insomnia. You were not pleased at all. You wanted to get rid of the X factor, and now it was there still.
And a few days ago, it took yet an other form: fear to fall asleep while meditating. (A strange fear, for someone suffering from insomnia, once you think of it ... ;) )
Again, you do not get what you want, and you are quite annoyed, understandably.
There is even a tone of need, and must, and danger  ...  Is that tone familiar, from the anxiety you had, say a year ago?

So in this view, there is something that you cannot see (yet) and of which you used to think as anxiety. In one month, through meditation, you found out, that it can take a very different form. And in a further two weeks you saw yet another form. You did not get what you wanted, but you got a lot of information. You do have an interaction with it, and it can change form. So at any rate, you are not simlpy stuck.

When I was around thirty, I had a period of four years, that I was afraid of spiders. Spider was a very powerful symbol for me. Before that time, Spider was powerful in my life and I was not even aware of it. During the time of confrontation, I was aware of Spider and learned by and by what it stood for, and learned how to handle it. Now I know it, and in a sense it is a helpful symbol. Still, Spider can wake me up. But now I know what is called for, I do that, and an hour later I go to sleep again. So I never got rid of Spider, but I got familiar with it; I see its strength, and find it annoying now and than, are glad with it at other times. Like going to the toilet, or washing dishes or attending to the garden.
There is always dishes to wash. Don't you worry. ;)

That is what I want to say at this time.

Like Andy sais: take care.

Oh, by the way: Do you know the feeling that you are being taken care of? Maybe not. If you do, it is now a good time to activate that feeling, to the amount that you need it. That may not be vipassana, but it can be helpful.

Be well,

Quardamon

Jhana4

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Re: Meditation is causing insomnia for me - why?
« Reply #34 on: February 03, 2011, 05:26:55 PM »
>>>JHANA4

Thanks a lot for your answer. I think I may be too bad at relaxing during meditation (mentally) and too much focused on doing it "the right way".. I think I will start to take some time to become relaxed first, before meditating.


Hi Dane.   You are missing the central point I made which you need to hear to get better ( sorry for the harsh language ).

Meditation  is a relaxation exercise.

You don't try to relax, you just do,  you let go to the best of your ability and don't think about it otherwise.   If you do that, relaxation and letting go will come on its own uninvited.

Quote
My experience is quite weird: I average only 4-5 hours of sleep every night, and my fingers are starting to feel slightly stiff - typing is kinda hard :). And I also feel dizzy during the day, and have trouble concentrating when at work. Bottom line - I am not getting enough sleep. Yet I feel so "awake" in a funny way during the day and at night. It's like when I lie down to sleep, I feel so alert, I can sense everything that is going with my body and breath, and the last thing I feel the need for, is to sleep.

It sounds like you have serious issues with insomnia that go way beyond wanting to meditate.

I had such issues in the distant past too. 

This book helped me to put an end to insomnia.  The first chapters are written poorly.....like a flim flam sales pitch.  Hold you nose and tough out the first few chapters.  The book works and is powerful:

http://www.amazon.com/Good-Night-Insomnia-Gregg-Jacobs/dp/0805089586/ref=sr_1_1?ie=UTF8&qid=1296753995&sr=8-1


kidnovice

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Re: Meditation is causing insomnia for me - why?
« Reply #35 on: February 04, 2011, 12:58:31 AM »
Hey Dane,

Although I haven't suffered insomnia quite as extreme as yours, I have experienced it in small bouts (also associated with meditating). This has been especially true in the last year. I've also found that even when I do fall asleep with ease, I now typically wake-up after 4-5 hours.

So, here are some things that I've been figuring out for myself:

(A) First and foremost, I try to not stay up past the time when I feel tired. That's a big issue for me. If I stay awake despite my tiredness (either by meditating or reading, or whatever), I get my "second wind," and then it becomes really hard to fall sleep. So, I try to pay attention to my body/mind. This means no falling asleep while meditating and "bolting" awake. If I let that happen, there is a good chance I will fully "re-energize myself and be unable to fall asleep. So, if I feel tired, I listen to it! The moment I start nodding off, I smile, get up, and lay in bed.

(B) As someone else mentioned, it is important to start my evening meditation a bit earlier. And if for whatever reason I begin meditating late (say past 9 or 10pm) , I accept that I will cut my meditation short if I feel tired.

(C) During my evening meditation, I give special attention to ways that I might be "straining" and "trying" (even in pleasant ways). I find that this subtle "straining" is what wakes me up. It is often enough for me to simply notice the straining, and then I stop doing it. :P (note:this is a bit like what Jhana4 said about relaxing)

(D) When I wake up in the middle night (after 4-5 hours of sleep), I don't let myself start thinking of plans, etc. Instead, I will usually begin watching my body, and find that I fall back asleep. However, I sometimes I find myself completely awake. When this happens, I try to accept it as quickly as possible (i.e., as opposed to tossing and turning for two hours). Once I realize that I'm awake, I immediately get up to meditate, and I will sit with the intention of practicing until I am tired enough to fall back asleep. I find that this usually takes 30 minutes to an hour. This meditation will usually be quite calm and pleasant (notwithstanding the fact that it is 4AM, and I have to get up at 7:30), and when I eventually go back to sleep, I actually get real rest.

Anyway, that has been my recent approach. I hope you get some benefit from my own experience and all the great advice you have received from others.

With metta,
KN
« Last Edit: February 04, 2011, 01:05:31 AM by kidnovice »
May we cultivate the serenity to accept the things we cannot change; the compassion to change the things we can; and the wisdom to know the difference.

DANE01

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Re: Meditation is causing insomnia for me - why?
« Reply #36 on: February 05, 2011, 02:09:57 AM »
Guys, thanks a lot for all your replies! You are helping me out more than you know - some of the advice you've given me, has helped me improve these last few days!

To answer a few questions first:

- Are you being safe: Well, yes.. I think so :). I am not getting enough sleep - about four hours per night. And I can feel it in my body. Yet, I don't feel as bad as I probably should. Meditation is somehow making me need less sleep. Normally I would be close to death after a month of only four hours of sleep every night. But im not. Im just dizzy, a bit sore and such. And BTW I take the metro for work, I dont drive ;-)

- Thanks for the advice of the book "Say Goodnight to Insomnia". It truly is a great book. I've read it before, as I used to suffer from insomnia, and that book helped me to cure myself of it, almost. But my recent insomnia problems are not due to bad sleeping habits. My sleeping problems have come sinced I started meditating.

- Are you seeing a doctor? Yes, I am seeing a psychologist, who is helping me cope with the anxiety. I've also contemplated seeing a meditation coach - there is one living nearby, fortunately.

Now to give you all an update, it has been an exciting last few days: I managed to defeat the fear of "falling asleep/becoming sleepy" during meditation, by simply confronting it and accepting it. The other day, I also managed to defeat my fear of lying down to sleep, where I would become aware of my breath and think that I was meditating. Actually the advice from Jhana and th Irr. Buddhist, helped me to acknowledge this fear once I got into bed - and voila, it lost its grip on me.

I think I am starting to see the punches coming in regards to anxiety and fear. Courage pays off - I am seeing progress! :) Yet I still can't fall asleep at night - when I lie down, I simply feel quite awake. It has happened tonight too - it's 3 in the morning now :). I dont feel awake in an anxiety way. Just awake, and uniterested in sleeping.

I will try to work more on letting go while meditating, and see if it helps. Moreover, I should probably also go to bed when I feel tired, and not stay up.

One thing that I have been thinking though, is that my problem with being much awake, is maybe due to the fact that I meditate when I feel tired or my body is winded? A couple of months ago, I felt great anxiety while meditating, and this feeling of anxiety would persist in my body for the next week or so after, even though I didnt meditate after that day! Fortunately I dont have this problem anymore. Yet, I cant help bu think that the problem may be that I am in this state of hyper-tired-energetic 24/7 - also when I meditate - and that my body notices this when I meditate and causes me to remain in this state thereaftrer?

Does it sound far-fetched?  :)

I have tried before that a feeling during meditation (anxiety or fear of falling asleep) would remain in my body for a week after. Could it be that the lack of sleep and the awake feeling is continued due to my body experiencing it every day through meditation?

All the best,
Dane

Matthew

  • The Irreverent Buddhist
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  • Meditation: It's a D.I.Y. project.
    • KISS: Keep it simple stupid.
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Re: Meditation is causing insomnia for me - why?
« Reply #37 on: February 07, 2011, 10:45:19 PM »
Dane,

It is good to hear you are finding your way. We can signpost for each other but each of us has to choose our own road.

One thing I would point out is that it can be quite natural for meditation to reduce the need for sleep. I am not entirely sure this is what is happening with you because from the sounds of it you do need a little more than you are getting. I think it is more related to the anxiety and it seems your current work is paying off and you will soon move beyond this phase.

Warm regards,

Matthew
~oOo~     Tat Tvam Asi     ~oOo~    How will you make the world a better place today?     ~oOo~    Fabricate Nothing     ~oOo~

friendlyhugstoall

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Re: Meditation is causing insomnia for me - why?
« Reply #38 on: February 08, 2011, 06:25:15 PM »
Dear  Dane,

In your place I would practice Metta and drop the practices of mindfulness and concentration for a while.
Although a practice of Metta can be a practice of concentration - that comes in the picture when you can generate the feeling of Metta and place your mind on it - when you come to that point, you can safely do whichever practice you want.
In mindfulness you meet both, pleasure and pain, physical and mental. It seems to me that you don’t need to get to know the way you relate to pain right now.
No climbing a mountain when you have a flu.
Concentration sharpens your attention. While you are meditating by placing your mind on an object, the feeling can be wonderful and all can look well and it is very healthy and all, but the sharpened attention will cut deeper into the mental storage. Very often happens just like that. The painful guests often crop up. The life off the cushion becomes once again tight and painful.
My advice is to drop both of these practices for a while.
Practice only Metta, please.
Each person whom I gave such advice, and they were in the kind of tremolo you are in, got much better, and slept well, and lived happier. I read and heard about many other as well. After getting skilled in Metta practice, they came back to mindfulness practice. That was my story too. I practiced for years, attended many retreats, but the deep change and well being came only when started to practice Metta.
Even more, deep down, these two practices, mindfulness and metta, don’t differ-just as Dipa Ma said  when asked what is the difference between metta and mindfulness.
You cannot grow tighter, more tense while you are practicing Metta. It is pretty impossible. It gives only benefit. Many benefits. One of them is sound sleep. I feel that the practice of Metta is for many many of us a true necessity.
Forgive me for being so direct.
Do you know how to practice Metta?
with Metta,
friendlyhugstoall

DANE01

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Re: Meditation is causing insomnia for me - why?
« Reply #39 on: February 08, 2011, 07:27:14 PM »
Hi Friendlyhugs

Thanks for the advice! I haven't heard about Metta meditation before though.. How does one practice it?

Best regards,
Dane

Jhana4

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Re: Meditation is causing insomnia for me - why?
« Reply #40 on: February 08, 2011, 07:45:05 PM »
Google on "metta meditation" or "loving kindness meditation", you will be buried under an avalanche of links to directions.


Morning Dew

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Re: Meditation is causing insomnia for me - why?
« Reply #41 on: February 08, 2011, 07:55:46 PM »
Metta didnt work for me  ;D
My ego self was laughing at it  :P ;D

Metta can easily turn into an ego game. Ego being a good person suddenly even though being a person is just a delusion, a nice good delusion, metta, fabricating loving kindness LoL.

I would advice Calm-Abiding first to relax into the body which is storing all the stressful tension, the traumas and such. Not concentrating, not focusing just simply being aware of the whole body breathing and relaxing with each in and out breath.

friendlyhugstoall how do you know that your Metta practice actually worked because you already practiced for retreats so many times before?  ;)

What is the use of encouraging a deluded Self to delude it self even more by repeating empty words without knowing its self at all, without understanding its actual deluded nature?  :)

Thank you for answering mate!

Dane, try and stick with JUST ONE practice and do it for at least 3-4 month to actually see if it is for you or not. Jumping from one to another just creates more tension.
If others have any compassion they will not try to push you away from the practice you already practice. Relax into the body and fabricate nothing. You can always start with Metta after 3-4 month. Metta will not run away  ;D

Hav det godt min ven  :)

Friendly Che

Morning Dew

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Re: Meditation is causing insomnia for me - why?
« Reply #42 on: February 08, 2011, 07:58:14 PM »
 ;D
Quote
you will be buried under an avalanche of links to directions.

And get even more confused  ;D  exactly why less reading and more practicing of calm abiding for the beginners is of great importance, at least for the first 3-4 month. Just take it easy and reeeelllaaxxxxxx  :)
Che

Jhana4

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Re: Meditation is causing insomnia for me - why?
« Reply #43 on: February 08, 2011, 08:06:38 PM »
;D
Quote
you will be buried under an avalanche of links to directions.

And get even more confused  ;D  exactly why less reading and more practicing of calm abiding for the beginners is of great importance, at least for the first 3-4 month. Just take it easy and reeeelllaaxxxxxx  :)
Che

I've taken my own advice in the past.   There are many sites giving brief and simple instructions for how to do metta meditation.

You have to put time into it like any other meditation method, but it does yield results.


DANE01

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Re: Meditation is causing insomnia for me - why?
« Reply #44 on: February 09, 2011, 07:46:17 PM »
Guys, thanks a lot for all your replies

I've decided to quit meditation for now: Over the past month and a half, I've averaged 4 hours of sleep every night, and am close to falling apart. I can feel my body aching from the lack of sleep, so unless I want to develop sleep deprivation ilnesses, I have to give it a rest for now. Hehe, this meditation experience has taken all of my personal courage: Last week my sleep was exceptionally bad, and for a full week I was so sleep deprived that I had trouble clenching my fists! It'll make a great story one day :)..

I talked to a local meditation instructor the other day, and he had never heard of meditation-induced sleep disorders on the scale that I have experienced it. He suggested it might try and start from scratch, and just try one minute of meditation every day, and see if that impairs my sleep. And if it doesn't, I could progressively turn up the volume over several months, to see if my body and mind adjusts to the meditation.

I think I may do that.

I don't really know why I react the way I do. I think I might be extremely sensitive to meditation: To give you an example, I had only meditated for 10 days, 10-20 mins a day, before my social anxiety literally was reduced by 90%. I felt as I was in a bliss all day, I felt an incredible surge of energy, like I wanted to run a marathon or climb a mountain. And all that after only 20 mins of meditation for 10 days.

I've overcome most of the anxiety-related reactions connected to meditation, such as my anxiety of falling to sleep while meditating, my hyper-awareness of my breath etc. Yesterday however, a new thing unfolded: As I lay in bed, and was very close to falling asleep, I got to the point where the mind just rushes your head with thoughts. You know the stage right before actual sleep. Normally we don't notice such thoughts as we are really relaxed. But yesterday I suddenly found myself very aware that I was having an incredible rush of thoughts, and I could follow and observe and be conscious of every thought as I was falling asleep. Weird! Needless to say, it weirded me out, and I woke up. And alas, another night of only 5 hours of sleep awaited me  :-\.

As Irr. Buddhist points out, I think that my heavy reactions to meditation, is due to my anxiety. And that my body and mind need to be accustomed to this new stimulus. It makes sense, as I've been able to gradually overcome every anxiety-related response during this past few weeks. In time, I think that I could also overcome this new awareness of my own thoughts before sleep, and actually get a good nights sleep. But my body is encouraging me to stop now :).

My first priority now, is to start getting some sleep again. After a week or two, I think I might give meditation another go. I have two options - I haven't really decided on which one to use yet:

  • Try mantra meditation for a few weeks and see if it impairs my sleep. It may be different: Research has shown that mindfulness and mantra meditation respectively activate different parts of the brain
  • Start progressively with mindfulness meditation with very short sittings and build slowly and gradually from there, to accustom my body and mind to meditation without experiencing sleep deprivation. I've noticed there also is a local meditation coach nearby, who might be able to help me to see if I do anything wrong in my meditation.

I don't really know which approach to assume, I can't really decide yet..

Please know that all of your advice has helped me. I am a newbie in meditation, so the valuable info that you've posted, has helped me in overcoming a lot of my doubts and anxiety regarding meditation!

Dane


Matthew

  • The Irreverent Buddhist
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  • Meditation: It's a D.I.Y. project.
    • KISS: Keep it simple stupid.
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Re: Meditation is causing insomnia for me - why?
« Reply #45 on: February 09, 2011, 09:03:14 PM »
See you in a couple of weeks friend :)
~oOo~     Tat Tvam Asi     ~oOo~    How will you make the world a better place today?     ~oOo~    Fabricate Nothing     ~oOo~

friendlyhugstoall

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Re: Meditation is causing insomnia for me - why?
« Reply #46 on: February 09, 2011, 09:15:40 PM »
Dear Dane,

Metta is a state of mind. Like mindfulness. Or hatred.
We don’t work directly on the feeling of metta just as we don’t work directly on mindfulness.
We work on its causes.
Like with a plant, we need a seed (that is already in each of us) and then we nourish it giving it enough water and sunlight. We cannot pull it out.
What causes Metta?
Wishing well. When you are steadily wishing well for yourself and/or others, there is a special energy that appears. It is called love. Or Metta.
The most important thing is to focus on the meaning of the following intentions.
May I be peaceful.
May I in a peaceful way experience sounds, pleasant, unpleasant, neutral.
May I in a peaceful, friendly way experience bodily sensations, whether pleasant, unpleasant or neutral.
May I in a peaceful, friendly, soft way experience thoughts, pleasant, unpleasant, neutral.[/b]
Focus on the meaning of it. Understand that it is well, it is good to be peaceful when experiencing any kind of bodily sensations, for example. The actual words don’t matter much. The meaning does matter. A lot.
May I experience my life in a friendly way.
May I be safe.
May I be healthy.
May I live happily.
May I be free from identification with negative mental states.
May I be free from identifying with anxiety.
May I be able to experience anxiety as a state that comes, does its scene, and then leaves.
May I experience insomnia in a friendly way.
May I be free from identification with insomnia.
May I be free in insomnia.
May I be peaceful.
See what makes sense to you. Understand intention. The meaning. Improvise and be creative.  Find your expressions of wishing well. Just wish yourself well.
In a week or two time, change the I with someone else. First with a person that easily triggers in you positive feelings, later on with whomever. (May you be peaceful....) If there is no one like that, don’t worry. Just keep on wishing good for yourself.

With metta,
fhta

friendlyhugstoall

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Re: Meditation is causing insomnia for me - why?
« Reply #47 on: February 09, 2011, 09:18:46 PM »
Dear Che,

You say Metta didn’t work for you...it already works for you mate, every day and many times a day. Before eating you wash your hands, and wash the food before cooking, don’t you? You take such a good care, don’t you? These are expressions of love. Of what else?
What do you think where do such actions come from? Such as washing your hands before eating? It comes from intention. Even more: In such case it comes from the intention to be well. That is metta. Furthermore, you cannot move your hand without intention.  Everything that is created has originated in intention. Your whole life actually.
It is very simple. If you are deliberately cultivating an intention then this intention becomes stronger. It takes over. If you are intending to play some tennis, and keep on bringing that intention, then you will play it.
If you are intending to be well, if you know how, if you meaningfully put your mind on it, then a special energy arises, a lot of it. It is called love. You have experienced it many times. You have very good intentions, and some of them are deeply ingrained. And that is very helpful and necessary at the same time. But when you are working directly on it, and keep on doing it, then you are nourished deeply.
You ask how do I know that it worked for me. One simply knows it, but it’s not easy to describe. How do you know how does an orange taste? Can you describe to me, how does an orange taste? You know it,  certainly, so please tell me.
You are talking about deluded self in such way. You are mistaken. There is no such thing as self. It cannot be deluded when there isn’t any in the first place. Just likewise, there is no awakened self. Self is a concept, just like a river. We are only wrongly believing. This is a river. This is me. No such thing as river. No such thing as self. But if I want to cross the river I construct a bridge and cross it. If I am hungry I eat. I hope you understand (if not, I’m not clear enough)
The power of intention is beyond any doubt whatsoever (and the skeptical doubt is the hindrance that you described when you practiced Metta, it is one of the five hindrances).
Buddha taught us: On the tip of your intention lies all of your destiny. Think about it for a while, friend.
Sorry for being so direct. My intention is that you get liberated and be free of suffering  and the causes of it :)
I send you much love,
fhta

Jhana4

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Re: Meditation is causing insomnia for me - why?
« Reply #48 on: February 09, 2011, 09:28:43 PM »
Two of the benefits of Metta meditation is that it decreases anxiety and helps sound sleep.

That didn't happen for me when I had my sleep problems, but it takes time to see the results.


Morning Dew

  • Guest
Re: Meditation is causing insomnia for me - why?
« Reply #49 on: February 09, 2011, 09:46:21 PM »
Quote
There is no such thing as self.

Agreed, but tell me friend who is this one repeating metta words May I be happy be free be a pop corn, etc... ?

There is no self yet the self created all the world outside and inside. The whole world suffers in their own fashoon yet we say there is no self. Cool! Who then creates all this suffering if there is no self?

Is there life out of the world of the self, the world made of past? Yes!
Can the self make an ego game out of metta? Yes it can. Sending love to others ... healing others etc...

I did reiki for a while healing my self and others ... Led me to nowhere but more confusion.

There is no love without first actualy facing the self as it is in solitude of the silence, fabricating nothing, invoking nothing not even metta. If metta is the actual me then i will be patient for it to rise out of the dark of ignorance of the nonexisting self.

Friendly Che :)

Hej Dane my friend do what feels right. Taking break can be very helpful. I actualy gained some very good insight when i stopped with meditation for a few weeks.

Good man.
« Last Edit: February 09, 2011, 09:51:01 PM by Che Guebuddha »